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Thread: artifacts / fog of war

  1. #31
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    I got sick of Portishead pretty quickly with their using the old-crackly vinyl thing on every track. was really cool at first but doesn't really last when overused. burial took it to a new level with the addition of sampled etherial divas weaving in and out, wasn't really "past" sound, more "lost" sounding. but I eventually got a kinda tried of his persistent use if it as well.

  2. #32
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    vinyl crackle is the nadir of this approach artistically imo. always hated it in burial.
    Last edited by mvuent; 29-11-2019 at 10:14 PM.

  3. #33
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    He didn't sample vinyl though, did he? He always said it was samples of fire, rain etc. There's definitely a Burial 'sample pack' at this point though: crackle, lighter flicks, shells hitting the floor, a car alarm, what sounds like shopping trolleys when they're pushed together, the sound of a cassette being ejected.

  4. #34
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    oh that's better then. i always tried to imagine it as those things but couldn't shake the vinyl association.

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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvuent View Post
    3. as diegetic sound. i.e. hearing these qualities as musical, as part of the recording's internal world. this is probably the view that's most creative and likely to be fruitful in the future. it suggests that the aforementioned magic of "fog of war" is completely separable from its associations with the past, and can be harnessed to make something new.
    And at the same time, I get nostalgic for things that didn't really exist. I might have a cassette from the first time a Melle Mel track, say, got played on radio in Manchester. And it might be a copy of a copy of a copy of a tape and there's all these weird nuances and distortions that have affected what I know as the truth, if you like, of that track. And I'll go and download or buy that original 12 and get it home and go, "Whoa, it sounds flatter than my version, the one that I've had for 15 years in my head is actually more exotic than had originally been intended in the studio at the time of making it."

    So I know that there's a lot of room to maneuver in those kind of ghostly musical spheres, you know what I mean? And we try and lean on those elements and try and blur the lines between certain sounds. I think that's the way some of the magic of music can be, even if it is a little bit from nowhere. Even if it doesn't really have any bearing on reality or grounding as a real piece of music. It might be an homage to a track that just sounds like my memory of a track, an homage to that memory as opposed to trying to recreate exactly how the song is.

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  8. #37
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    Corpsey's law.

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  10. #38

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    "cancelled" really is the word for it.
    it was forward looking, the skaters/emeralds/opn/sky limousine school builds on sonic referents of synth-prog, new age and video game soundtracks but doesn't at all feel like that music. it's not a re-creation, those kinds of morphogenetic/drug spaces and emotional territories are just not explored in your heldons and tangerine dreams. i know because i took a deep dive to compare one to the other, to see if the former being accused of being derivative of the latter held water. it doesn't, really.
    if anything, the frictionless, well-promoted, "nice-sounding"/"impeccably engineered" stuff feels more backward looking of the two. my reasoning is that its sonic reference to the past is more recognisable because this fog is not present. it doesn't have to be struggled past to be heard, the reverbed slide guitars, the 808 drums, the 'smooth' 'rnb' keys and voices.
    Quote Originally Posted by luka View Post
    It says bless the lads and it means bless the lads.
    Quote Originally Posted by sadmanbarty View Post
    i don't know, probably some marxist cultural theory or something
    Quote Originally Posted by thirdform View Post
    gabber terrorism is fun but not all the time, sometimes you gotta be sophisticated or sulky for the ladies.
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  12. #39

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    a very forward looking way to achieve 'fog of war' without being able to be pigeonholed as 'retro' is not necessarily or exclusively to put things to tape -

    'wrong'/'brickwalled' compression in contexts outside of pop music is the thing, using digital effects 'wrong' in general.
    this is where 'vaporwave' both departs from and is continuous with 'hypnagogic pop', in that something like 'redefining the workplace' relies as much on Every Ableton Effect At The Stupidest Settings At Once as something like 'jarvid 9' relies on natural cassette tape compression.
    the comparison could even be seen as 1:1.

    putting things through amps and recording them as such rather than having everything be in-box/direct inject is key, also. capturing how the sound pushes the air on record rather than having the record be this abstract digital space. this sets what you do apart from things having the sort of audio-watermark of their workstation/line of equipment.
    Quote Originally Posted by luka View Post
    It says bless the lads and it means bless the lads.
    Quote Originally Posted by sadmanbarty View Post
    i don't know, probably some marxist cultural theory or something
    Quote Originally Posted by thirdform View Post
    gabber terrorism is fun but not all the time, sometimes you gotta be sophisticated or sulky for the ladies.
    https://manifestacionesoterica.bandcamp.com/

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  14. #40

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    in fact, wakesleep/datavis as a longer arc over the 2010s, as robin burnett's documented self-actualisation in music, really goes deep on new ways to achieve the fog of war without falling back on "put it through tape or (worse) tape-like plugins". even the way samples are edited/juxtaposed on their stuff which is in-box/direct-inject is about fog - things click, it's uncomfortable, there are audible seams.
    Quote Originally Posted by luka View Post
    It says bless the lads and it means bless the lads.
    Quote Originally Posted by sadmanbarty View Post
    i don't know, probably some marxist cultural theory or something
    Quote Originally Posted by thirdform View Post
    gabber terrorism is fun but not all the time, sometimes you gotta be sophisticated or sulky for the ladies.
    https://manifestacionesoterica.bandcamp.com/

  15. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by other_life View Post
    a very forward looking way to achieve 'fog of war' without being able to be pigeonholed as 'retro' is not necessarily or exclusively to put things to tape -

    'wrong'/'brickwalled' compression in contexts outside of pop music is the thing, using digital effects 'wrong' in general.
    this is where 'vaporwave' both departs from and is continuous with 'hypnagogic pop', in that something like 'redefining the workplace' relies as much on Every Ableton Effect At The Stupidest Settings At Once as something like 'jarvid 9' relies on natural cassette tape compression.
    the comparison could even be seen as 1:1.

    putting things through amps and recording them as such rather than having everything be in-box/direct inject is key, also. capturing how the sound pushes the air on record rather than having the record be this abstract digital space. this sets what you do apart from things having the sort of audio-watermark of their workstation/line of equipment.
    good point, using new technical means to imitate anachronistic "fog of war" effects orients you in a good direction. failure to achieve something old resulting in something new and all.

  16. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by thirdform View Post
    genuine q. what actually defines chillwave?
    Quote Originally Posted by other_life View Post
    effortless gestures. seductive vacuousness. entirely from the wrist, no deliberation, composition or even thought involved. the aesthetics or social connections are not really the common denominator. it's the lack of effort required to spin something bigger out of stupid-simple gestures.
    this gets at what's prevented me from exploring ferraro et al more. the worry that all the messing with "fog of war" amounts to a gimmick, that listening to the first five minutes is enough as far as his early material goes.

    as you point out though, toil-less composition can produce results. (my favorite era of aphex is when he was spending 3 hours per track, for example.) so maybe that concern isn't a fair one. what's not to like about seductive vacuousness?

    but still, there is a sense in which what I want to hear is probably different from what a lot of these artists want. I'd want to manipulate the seams into a form of some kind. going back to the talk in the electroacoustic threads of creating a sense of reality bending. and surely it's harder to get there with the kind of breezy approach described.
    Last edited by mvuent; 30-11-2019 at 06:46 AM.

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  18. #43
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    Who or what are we at war with?

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by other_life View Post
    putting things through amps and recording them as such rather than having everything be in-box/direct inject is key, also. capturing how the sound pushes the air
    eventually leading you to do shit like this


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  21. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by version View Post
    Who or what are we at war with?
    the concepticons

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