Serial Killers

Benny Bunter

Benny Bunter

Well-known member
Haven't read them all properly yet but there's new articles in the New Yorker, the guardian and the telegraph all casting doubt on the Letby conviction. Among other things, no motive for the supposed crimes has ever been established.
 
0bleak

0bleak

A Liniment's Evil Work
www.theguardian.com

‘They’re a mystery’: inside the deadly world of serial killer truckers

A shocking new book sheds light on the many long-hauler killers in the US who operate close to many Americans yet remain dangerously undetected
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

"Long-haul trucking is the number one profession of serial killers."

"Figliuzzi, a former assistant director of Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) who served in the bureau for 25 years, was himself floored to learn of at least 850 murders along America’s highways over the past few decades. More than 200 cases remain active and unsolved; the bureau has a list of about 450 suspects."
 
mixed_biscuits

mixed_biscuits

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Benny Bunter said:
Haven't read them all properly yet but there's new articles in the New Yorker, the guardian and the telegraph all casting doubt on the Letby conviction. Among other things, no motive for the supposed crimes has ever been established.
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Can you imagine how stupid you have to be to attack on social media the expert statistician who already helped to exonerate two other nurses implicated in very similar circumstances?:

Richard Gill, an emeritus professor of mathematics at Leiden University in the Netherlands, was involved in two cases similar to Letby’s in which statistical coincidence was wrongly used in part to convict two nurses of murdering their patients: Lucia de Berk, a neonatal nurse in the Netherlands, and Daniela Poggiali in Italy. Their convictions were eventually quashed, thanks in part to Gill’s contributions.

Gill, who has drawn much criticism for pointedly posting on social media during the trial that the Letby shift table was meaningless and that she had suffered a miscarriage of justice, said: “The police investigation and crown prosecution made all the mistakes the RSS warned about. Nobody studied the statistics in a professional way.”
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The dumbest thing seems to be the association between Letby's presence and the deaths being said to be evidence of her causing them, while also being told that Letby was routinely called in to be present when babies were in most trouble. How can the pattern of her attendance then play any role in building a case against her?

It's like accusing a driver of the F1 safety car as being the cause of all of the season's crashes because he always turns up afterwards.
 
mixed_biscuits

mixed_biscuits

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Similarly, whenever I see a fire i see these dodgy guys in dirty macs near a whopping great red truck. Surely this truck would be easy enough to spot for the police and we could stop them setting everything on fire.
 
Benny Bunter

Benny Bunter

Well-known member
So, in summary - no motive ever established, the statistical evidence is essentially meaningless according to a growing number of experts (she wasn't present at the deaths of another six babies which weren't mentioned in the trial), no-one actually saw her do anything at all, the midnight ravings of a troubled mind in the scribbled note were taken as a confession, the alleged method of killing through injecting air is almost totally implausible, and it looks like her defence team totally maffed it up. 😞

 
mixed_biscuits

mixed_biscuits

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Benny Bunter said:
So, in summary - no motive ever established, the statistical evidence is essentially meaningless according to a growing number of experts (she wasn't present at the deaths of another six babies which weren't mentioned in the trial), no-one actually saw her do anything at all, the midnight ravings of a troubled mind in the scribbled note were taken as a confession, the alleged method of killing through injecting air is almost totally implausible, and it looks like her defence team totally maffed it up. 😞

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Letby freed at night to avoid attention, golden locks flowing, embarks on Tarantino-esque vengeance spree.
 
Benny Bunter

Benny Bunter

Well-known member
It's well sinister that the appeals court turned her request down so quickly, and access to that New Yorker arricle was essentially suppressed on this side of the pond
 
mixed_biscuits

mixed_biscuits

_________________________
Benny Bunter said:
It's well sinister that the appeals court turned her request down so quickly, and access to that New Yorker arricle was essentially suppressed on this side of the pond
Click to expand...
We saw during Covid how the establishment could suddenly coordinate and tie a noose around complicating information. With Letby this process seemingly happened not only at the top but on a microcosmic scale around events at the hospital.

You get a kind of confirmation bias as a particular take on events is judged to be very likely to be true with insufficient evidence and then that judgement biases further evidence gathering, confirming the prejudice after the fact.
 
mixed_biscuits

mixed_biscuits

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What could be done for this sort of thing is that the prosecutors must submit a supporting document that schematises the logic of their argument e.g. Letby did it if and only if: A) the pattern of events in the ward was statistically highly unusual AND B) her letter was proof of a guilty mind AND C) whatever circumstantial detail...the defence can then appeal once a year to attempt to rebut any of those dependencies and if it's rebutted the sentence is quashed. This would provide an easy avenue for the fixing of clear and obvious errors and direct people to those points which are actually crucial to the sentence.
 
Benny Bunter

Benny Bunter

Well-known member
This is a good read as well. It's not at all internet nutter conspiracy stuff, seems like they really did just make a massive hash of the statistics, and they should never have been included in the prosecution cos they would have seriously misled the jury, but they somehow got through.

Lucy Letby: another miscarriage of justice driven by courts’ failure to grasp statistics? – The Justice Gap

www.thejusticegap.com www.thejusticegap.com

Not on the Letby case, but it seems like they made a very similar error:

The same point was made in the Ben Geen case by his barrister Mark McDonald by reference to what is often called the ‘Texas sharpshooter fallacy’.

‘Imagine we are both looking at the side of a shed,’ McDonald told me. ‘I say: “I bet you £20 I can get ten bullets into the centre of a target from a distance of 200 yards using my machine gun.” You say: ‘No way.’ So, I fire my machine gun into the side of the shed releasing 100 bullets. They’re all over the place. I walk up to the shed and draw a circle around ten of the bullets and place a target over it. That’s effectively what they did. They selectively put the target round ten patients. That’s why I say no crime is committed here.’
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versh

versh

Well-known member
This bloke's an absolute psycho:

www.bbc.co.uk

Mass killer Louis van Schoor tells BBC of police collusion

Ex-security guard, Louis van Schoor, killed dozens in South Africa but was only jailed for seven murders.
www.bbc.co.uk

The so-called “Apartheid Killer” has lost his teeth. His health is waning. Following a heart attack, both his legs were recently amputated, leaving him in a wheelchair, with painful scars. When his surgeon carried out this procedure, Van Schoor requested an epidural instead of a general anaesthetic - so he could watch them remove his legs.

“I was curious,” he said, chuckling. “I saw them cutting… they sawed through the bone.”
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Over a three-year period in the 1980s under the country’s racist apartheid system - which imposed a strict hierarchy that privileged white South Africans - Van Schoor shot and killed at least 39 people.

All of his victims were black. The youngest was just 12 years old.
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“I was barefoot. It’s quiet. You don’t have your shoes squeaking on tiles and stuff,” he said.

He would never switch the light on. Instead, he relied on his sense of smell.

“If somebody breaks in, the adrenaline gives off an odour. And you can pick that up,” he said.

Van Schoor claims he never went out “with the intention of killing black people” and says he is not a racist. But he admits he found stalking them in the dark “exciting”.
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Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
I'd love to see version adopt a Danny Dyer-esque persona and present a TV series about famous killers, making liberal use of terms like "psycho", "nutter" and "mad fucking bastard" to describe them.
 
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