Why does the left hate crypto so much?

Binance seizing all Palestine crypto assets at the request of Israeli government

The exact antithesis of what this was meant to be, what a load of shit
Not your keys, not your crypto. They probably have at least some in cold storage, or in non-custodial wallets, that cannot be seized. Lost if a keyman eats a JDAM, yes, but not seized.
 

wg-

Well-known member
If they have any sense they would of course have their own cold storage, and most with sense are out of binance a long time ago, yes.

But this is a fucking terrible precedent irrespective of whatever political affiliation you are
 

kid charlemagne

Well-known member
Can I get an opinion on this from noted leftist and Hamas/crypto fan, @kid charlemagne?
none of this news will make me change my stances.... the fact of the matter is is that zionist control so many govs countries.... follow the money... this also gives me the idea that zionist and govs and the powers that b understand the power potential of crypto more than people would like to think. with this said, it is unfortunate to have money seized, but there are other options than binance (myself for one). also to what i was saying, this isnt cryptos fault, they are not the villain, they are just being on a leash and controlled by the villain. there is a world for palestine/hamas and crypto to both be in power in their own right. this is a matter of circumstance.... get ready for next 5 to 10 years.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
none of this news will make me change my stances.... the fact of the matter is is that zionist control so many govs countries.... follow the money...
Are you sure about that? All the countries in green voted in favour of a UN resolution last year calling for an immediate ceasefire and truce in Gaza:

UN_Resolution_regarding_the_2023_Israel–Hamas_war.svg (1).png

The only country of any international importance to vote against, other than Israel itself, was the USA.

I think you're getting into very dodgy territory when you start painting Israel as somehow directly controlling other governments, which is what people have said about Jews since long before Israel existed.

With regard to crypto specifically, I'm aware there are platforms other than Binance, but it is the biggest one, and it's not a good look given that crypto was supposed to be a form of money that governments had no control over, as WG has already pointed out.
 

Clinamenic

Binary & Tweed
Binance seizing all Palestine crypto assets at the request of Israeli government

The exact antithesis of what this was meant to be, what a load of shit
Yeah this is the most fundamental paradox/misnomer in the crypto industry: the most used (i.e. by far the most user-friendly) ways of getting exposure to crypto markets involve the same custodial arrangements as legacy financial institutions.

With self-custodial wallets, this can't be done (unless government agents spear phish you or compromise your private key), but even here you can have government block access points to convert crypto to fiat currency.
 

Clinamenic

Binary & Tweed
The P2P financial settlement infrastructure exists, and to be sure that is a profound innovation itself, but its still way too complex for most people to be comfortable using. In order for this to really have its full effect, it needs to be more user-friendly without compromising on the self-custody. Work is being done on this front, but I'm not sure it will happen before the tech is de facto captured by institutions and governments.
 

Clinamenic

Binary & Tweed
With regard to crypto specifically, I'm aware there are platforms other than Binance, but it is the biggest one, and it's not a good look given that crypto was supposed to be a form of money that governments had no control over, as WG has already pointed out.
Yeah its not a good look, and in cases like this its because platforms like Binance masquerade as real crypto products/services when, really, they are functionally equivalent to traditional financial institutions, but just offer custodied exposure to crypto markets. The devil really is in the details here, but the nuance is just lost in most discourse about it, and understandably so because its a technical matter.
 

Clinamenic

Binary & Tweed
Governments can control crypto insofar as crypto market volume and/or underlying network compute is managed by institutions subject to coordinated government regulation.
 

Clinamenic

Binary & Tweed
So its not impossible, its just a difficult power for governments to attain and a delicate power for them to maintain.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
Yeah its not a good look, and in cases like this its because platforms like Binance masquerade as real crypto products/services when, really, they are functionally equivalent to traditional financial institutions, but just offer custodied exposure to crypto markets. The devil really is in the details here, but the nuance is just lost in most discourse about it, and understandably so because its a technical matter.
Man, I really miss the days when proper leftists wanted to abolish money altogether and just ensure everyone got their daily bean ration or whatever.
 

Clinamenic

Binary & Tweed
Man, I really miss the days when proper leftists wanted to abolish money altogether and just ensure everyone got their daily bean ration or whatever.
Haha yeah, crypto leftists (which, yes, are an actual thing) do tend to like this idea of local currencies, but it seems hard to have that scale beyond, say, a commune.
 

william kent

Well-known member
Surely you'd have to call any political group something like 'Bitcoin-leftists' rather than 'Crypto-' as terms like 'Crypto-fascist' were around long before cryptocurrencies and mean something different.
 

Clinamenic

Binary & Tweed
Yeah if I was semantic overlord I would make a lot of changes haha. Blockchain leftists as such are kinda rare, but if we're just talking about progressive and communitarian social values, those are well represented, if even notionally, in the circles I prefer to traffic in.

There aren't really ideological "-ist" signifiers used a lot here though. Tech hippies, open source / peer-to-peer communitarians, pro-social technologists, market leftists, etc, however are all accurate in different senses.

If I were to assign any unifying -ism, it might be post-capitalism. A lot of these folks, myself included, are trying to figure out how capitalism can be improved to better account for collective welfare.
 

Clinamenic

Binary & Tweed
And a lot of that, in my opinion, consists of open-source, peer-to-peer infrastructure, like some of the protocols underpinning the internet, and like certain blockchain tech.
 

william kent

Well-known member
If I were to assign any unifying -ism, it might be post-capitalism. A lot of these folks, myself included, are trying to figure out how capitalism can be improved to better account for collective welfare.

How would improved capitalism be post-capitalism? It would still be capitalism.
 

Clinamenic

Binary & Tweed
How would improved capitalism be post-capitalism? It would still be capitalism.
Just depends on how you define post- really. Like in my mind, it would preserve the "good" parts of capitalism, like free/mixed markets, but mitigate the "bad" parts, like public goods not being adequately funded or basic welfare not being (prudently) provided.

Call it what you may, and really the term 'capitalism' I think could be worth ditching, but the term 'post-capitalism' is often used in my circles to refer to a more humane, idealized evolution of our current paradigm.
 

Clinamenic

Binary & Tweed
In and of itself, the term 'neoliberalism' I think would semantically make a good candidate for what I have in mind, but of course that one is already taken. 'Postliberalism' might make sense, but here again the 'post-' wouldn't mean an exclusionary departure from liberalism but a sublation beyond it.
 

kid charlemagne

Well-known member
Are you sure about that? All the countries in green voted in favour of a UN resolution last year calling for an immediate ceasefire and truce in Gaza:

View attachment 19953

The only country of any international importance to vote against, other than Israel itself, was the USA.

I think you're getting into very dodgy territory when you start painting Israel as somehow directly controlling other governments, which is what people have said about Jews since long before Israel existed.

With regard to crypto specifically, I'm aware there are platforms other than Binance, but it is the biggest one, and it's not a good look given that crypto was supposed to be a form of money that governments had no control over, as WG has already pointed out.
i AM AN AMERICAN!
 
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