Poor State of Grime

[Woebot]

Not looking too good out there I'm afraid.

The Roll Deep record, it's pretty rubbish isnt it! I read Silverdollar on it, and that finally made me cough up and buy it (I want a refund Simon! )

The KANO LP, well I'm gonna have to spend some more time with it, but thus far I'm not terribly impressed.

And there's nothing whatsoever at independance that grabs me at all!

I thought the summer was the time for big tunes!! Is "Sidewinder" the best anyone can come up with!!!!

(disappointed, not beaten, but disappointed)

 

[simon silverdollar]

have you listened to Mac 10's show on rinse, 7-9pm fridays [logan's old slot]? there's a crazy amount of amazing new stuff being played on there.

 

[SMorlighem]

Roll Deep, Kano, etc.

I might be more on Silverdollar's side than yours, Matt, about the Roll Deep album, I think it's more clever than rubbish (more about it as soon as I've finished my review). But I assume my opinion might be really trans/deformed by the fact I totally ignored (being in other stuff) rap/hip-hop music between 1985 & 2003, and not being a londoner, following the urban/garage scene for years

Saw Kano & Ghetto last saturday in the Parc de la Villette, great air rave, lots of freestyle on the last grime hits (Singalong, Hood Up, Str8flush, Underground, etc.), too bad Demon wasn't here.
I interviewed Kano after the gig, very professional/cold-eyed artist-like (I guess he wanted to read his FHM magazine copy he handed during the balance & during the interview ), but I managed to hook him up a bit ; then I chatted with Ghetto, nice bloke, having a mixtape out this summer, working on his album like everybody in the scene.

 

[bun-u]

I get the feeling that the first artist brave enough to produce and put out a wall to wall 'grime' album is going to clean up.....silverdollar says that grime encompasses all the cheesier stuff (and maybe it does but do a much smaller extent than is weighted on these albums)

I just think the scene is ready now for someone to release something which nails that pirate sessions sound fully.

 

[hmg]

I get the feeling that the first artist brave enough to produce and put out a wall to wall 'grime' album is going to clean up.....silverdollar says that grime encompasses all the cheesier stuff (and maybe it does but do a much smaller extent than is weighted on these albums)

I just think the scene is ready now for someone to release something which nails that pirate sessions sound fully.

Dizzee Rascal, Boy in da corner, 2003?

 

[Blackdown]

i agree with woe, it has gone a bit quiet.

tracks from radio sets keeping me enthused are...

ruff sqwad + wiley 'together'
that 'mozart manor' tune
bruza 'so real'
the danny weed 12" on southside
wiley 'i need space'
bashy 'pryin'

hmm lots of more mellow tunes on that list.

am looking forward to the Newham Generals LP.

 

[DJL]

Check out the new Statik album and forthcoming Newham Generals album for "pure" grime.

 

[SMorlighem]

ruff sqwad + wiley 'together'

Fascinating tune ; didn't like it at first then growing... Really looking forward to Ruff Sqwad future releases, 'Underground's definitely one of the strongest tracks of the scene.

am looking forward to the Newham Generals LP.

That might be the best surprise of the year!

What about the All-Stars tunes which are popping up from everywhere nowadays after 'Pow' ? 'Sidewinder' of course, but also the 13-minutes 'Radar' (Terror Danjah) which I adore.

 

[3underscore]

Both Grime and Dubstep are quiet right now

Earlier in the year I would easily be able to spend £50 in Uptown each time I went in. There is no turnover of vinyl in there at the moment. It seems to have gone through a quite surprising lull, although I suppose things were coming out at break-neck speed earlier this year.

Word on Dubstep is Tempa / Soulja are looking to get a schedule of fortnightly releases together to get some momentum back (dubstep has all been back catalogue of late). Skream "late night request line" drops, finally, in 2 weeks.

 

[Grievous Angel]

I'm surprised that Matt's disappointed by Grime albums. Dance music artists are generally rubbish at doing albums, trying to do the auteur thing when people really want the singles (or mixes). Same is broadly true of hip hop though to a lesser degree. And as HMG points out, we've already had one decent artist album out of Grime. What grime needs is fewer artist albums and more compilations. Certainly I don't think the Roll Deep album is a good yardstick of how well grime as a whole is doing. It sounded alright (if lightweight) when they did the promo slot on Westwood, though.

3underscore's point is more worrying. If decent tunes aren't being released (probably because people are refining their artistic vision in the studio instead of bunging out records) then the momentum of the scene will just collspse.

 

[bassnation]

3underscore's point is more worrying. If decent tunes aren't being released (probably because people are refining their artistic vision in the studio instead of bunging out records) then the momentum of the scene will just collspse.

and even then, the tunes are being rinsed on dubplate for an eternity before the average punter gets hold of them - just like the old moans people used to have about jungle tunes. its frustrating trying to track tunes down - no doubt whatsoever theres some quality stuff being produced, its just getting it into peoples hands.

as an outsider, the scene to me doesn't seem to want to be big and it could be cos the music is fucking superb. but people seem happy doing their own thing completely underground - talking more about dubstep than grime. i've heard loads of grime tunes with mcs going on about "breaking through to the overground".

 

[Logan Sama]

That's strange.

The Roll Deep and Kano albums were both "really exciting" when they hadn't been released and people were trading radio rips and leaked copies of tracks.

 

[Blackdown]

and even then, the tunes are being rinsed on dubplate for an eternity before the average punter gets hold of them - just like the old moans people used to have about jungle tunes. its frustrating trying to track tunes down - no doubt whatsoever theres some quality stuff being produced, its just getting it into peoples hands.

i dont think people who have never released a record, appreciate how much hassle and cost it is to put one out. you pay all the costs upfront, put months of effort in getting it out there and then get paid in dribs and drabs back. somedays you break even. the simple bit is going to the shop and buying a 12"...

 

[bassnation]

i dont think people who have never released a record, appreciate how much hassle and cost it is to put one out. you pay all the costs upfront, put months of effort in getting it out there and then get paid in dribs and drabs back. somedays you break even. the simple bit is going to the shop and buying a 12"...

i do appreciate it - my mates just started a record label (http://www.offkeyindustries.com/news.php) and hes moved heaven and earth just to find a distributor and get tracks into the shops, all at great expense to himself both in terms of time and money. its a labour of love with scant chance of profit.

but from a punters point of view just want to get hold of as much good dubstep as i can get my hands on. nothing wrong with that, is there?

maybe if the digital downloads thing takes off then it will be easier, esp. for those people overseas who want to keep up.

 

[hint]

i dont think people who have never released a record, appreciate how much hassle and cost it is to put one out. you pay all the costs upfront, put months of effort in getting it out there and then get paid in dribs and drabs back. somedays you break even. the simple bit is going to the shop and buying a 12"...

Of course, this is often overlooked / misunderstood by the buying public - I agree.

but would you not agree that the people releasing records in underground scenes often don't appreciate how much difference a controlled promotional campaign can make? I'm talking about the low level stuff here too when I say "campaign" - everything from putting up info on your website / blog to giving out dubs to DJs.

Fair enough, if it's the first thing you've ever put out it's understandable that you might misjudge the amount of time it takes to get from finished track to product on the shelves. But once you either make the mistakes once or twice yourself or see other people make them it's pretty easy to plan things more effectively -

- make tunes
- get reactions from a very specific group of people who will give you some idea about whether or not the music is worth releasing
- arrange the manufacture
- once that process is underway, then send out CDrs / tell people about it / plan a release date and do everything you can to stick to it

I got into UKG / Grime through your column in Muzik and I quickly learnt that I'd have to write down the names of any tunes that you'd inspired me to check out cos I knew that I often wouldn't be able to find them for weeks (perhaps even months).

Now I've got web access I know that there's little point in paying much attention to the tracklistings of radio sets - I just check the shows for "entertainment", then listen to everything that gets put up on the Independance, Juno and Uptown sites... who knows, sooner or later I might come across that track I heard 3 months ago on a Rinse FM MP3, but I'm not going to waste my time trying to find out anything about it in the meantime.

 

[bassnation]

Now I've got web access I know that there's little point in paying much attention to the tracklistings of radio sets - I just check the shows for "entertainment", then listen to everything that gets put up on the Independance, Juno and Uptown sites... who knows, sooner or later I might come across that track I heard 3 months ago on a Rinse FM MP3, but I'm not going to waste my time trying to find out anything about it in the meantime.

thats got to be the best way - still, chuffed that late nite caller is out soon. thats definitely one of those tunes i would have spent years looking for, if necessary.

 

[bun-u]

i do appreciate it - my mates just started a record label (http://www.offkeyindustries.com/news.php) and hes moved heaven and earth just to find a distributor and get tracks into the shops, all at great expense to himself both in terms of time and money. its a labour of love with scant chance of profit.

but from a punters point of view just want to get hold of as much good dubstep as i can get my hands on. nothing wrong with that, is there?

maybe if the digital downloads thing takes off then it will be easier, esp. for those people overseas who want to keep up.

Maybe these productions methods are too cumbersome and are slowing the scene down. I love vinyl to bits, but do you still need to press dubplates and white labels to get the music out there?

 

[3underscore]

Maybe these productions methods are too cumbersome and are slowing the scene down. I love vinyl to bits, but do you still need to press dubplates and white labels to get the music out there?

That was one thing that was commented on. It is all DVDs at the moment - understandable as they are dirt cheap to produce, easy to flex the volume of, and carry more.

But, of course it is all still about vinyl. Especially dubstep (for me) anyhow.

 

[shudder]

Now I've got web access I know that there's little point in paying much attention to the tracklistings of radio sets - I just check the shows for "entertainment", then listen to everything that gets put up on the Independance, Juno and Uptown sites... who knows, sooner or later I might come across that track I heard 3 months ago on a Rinse FM MP3, but I'm not going to waste my time trying to find out anything about it in the meantime.

I'm a clueless North American... where are these sites?

 

[hint]

I'm a clueless North American... where are these sites?

juno
independance
uptown