Curse of Perfection

[version]

Is there anything which isn't ultimately ruined in being perfected?

The other day, catching up on the football, I read a few people lamenting City's stranglehold on the PL. They're undoubtedly brilliant, but as Pep irons out the kinks, it does seem as though he's draining the life out of the sport. There's less room for characters and the unpredictable with his method. The ideal's a finely tuned machine, each component more or less interchangeable. It can be wicked to watch, but we draw closer and closer to some ice cold simulation incapable of making the mistakes that fuel the game's dramatic engine.

I doubt he actually will perfect it, or that it's possible to eliminate the unpredictable, but he's taken it to a point of such remarkable consistency the audience are beginning to suffer.

We've talked about a similar process in music production and the switch from film to digital. The stats side of sport's the big one in my head at the moment though. The tweaking of F1 cars to shave off fractions of a second. It feels like diminishing returns from the viewer's perspective. Results and Entertainment at each other's throats.

Is it possible to hold this position without slipping into some form of Luddism or Reaction? Is there any system which remains healthy/functional and doesn't seek to develop itself?

 

[mixed_biscuits]

Is there anything which isn't ultimately ruined in being perfected?

The other day, catching up on the football, I read a few people lamenting City's stranglehold on the PL. They're undoubtedly brilliant, but as Pep irons out the kinks, it does seem as though he's draining the life out of the sport. There's less room for characters and the unpredictable with his method. The ideal's a finely tuned machine, each component more or less interchangeable. It can be wicked to watch, but we draw closer and closer to some ice cold simulation incapable of making the mistakes that fuel the game's dramatic engine.

I doubt he actually will perfect it, or that it's possible to eliminate the unpredictable, but he's taken it to a point of such remarkable consistency the audience are beginning to suffer.

We've talked about a similar process in music production and the switch from film to digital. The stats side of sport's the big one in my head at the moment though. The tweaking of F1 cars to shave off fractions of a second. It feels like diminishing returns from the viewer's perspective. Results and Entertainment at each other's throats.

Is it possible to hold this position without slipping into some form of Luddism or Reaction? Is there any system which remains healthy/functional and doesn't seek to develop itself?

This doesn't encompass perfection in its entirety, as what your examples are are optimising for one thing rather than more than one. All those are optimising for winning/making the most money (the digital quality is worse than celluloid so it's not artistic optimisation for film). There are sports teams that optimise for winning and entertainment with the latter being compulsory e.g. traditional Manchester United, Postecoglou, Bielsa, Bazball.

It's not that much of a problem unless an unentertaining formula becomes the norm across the board...this has happened in tennis and it's overall worse, but in football you can't have a game in which both teams play like Man City and the best way to beat Man City is to play an up and at 'em exciting style. Football seems to be self-correcting to an extent: even Guardiola has said himself that he needs maverick dribblers to break up formulaic systems.

 

[mixed_biscuits]

The other thing is that Man City have an unfairly good personnel and, without FFP violation, they would not be able to be the top team playing in that way as they wouldn't have the skills across the board. It's really about Guardiola's personal preferences because the quality of his players means they could play in lots of different ways and still win the league.

 

[germaphobian]

Is it possible to hold this position without slipping into some form of Luddism or Reaction? Is there any system which remains healthy/functional and doesn't seek to develop itself?

No and no.

 

[germaphobian]

It's like that punishment machine in Penal Colony.

 

[linebaugh]

you can just tag me next time

 

[Corpsey]

Weird I was thinking about this earlier, purely in a musical context, cos of listening to albini interviews where he talks about hating disco, I assume in part cos it was mainstream but mainly (comparing disco to his own aesthetic) it's smoothness, it's perfection.

And I was listening to Sister Sledge on a bike ride and loving it as always but also could hear how somebody who was into rough/raw/unpolished music could find it all too seamlessly slotted together and pristine.

 

[Corpsey]

In pop music there is an ironing out of human imperfection, the vocals are all "perfect" (whether or not you like them), a thousand takes spliced together and fed through an autotune.

Perhaps it was always this way in pop music.

It's interesting that the appeal of pop stars now (and like i said maybe forever) seems so persona/personality based, it's all about stanning them as people keeping tabs on their relationships etc. the personality isn't perhaps getting into the music. (I know Taylor swift sings about her boyfriends so maybe that scuttles my argument but YOU MUST AGREE WITH MY RADICAL PROPOSAL ABOUT MODERN MEGA POP SOUNDING INHUMAN

 

[Corpsey]

 

[version]

This doesn't encompass perfection in its entirety, as what your examples are are optimising for one thing rather than more than one. All those are optimising for winning/making the most money (the digital quality is worse than celluloid so it's not artistic optimisation for film). There are sports teams that optimise for winning and entertainment with the latter being compulsory e.g. traditional Manchester United, Postecoglou, Bielsa, Bazball.

It's not that much of a problem unless an unentertaining formula becomes the norm across the board...this has happened in tennis and it's overall worse, but in football you can't have a game in which both teams play like Man City and the best way to beat Man City is to play an up and at 'em exciting style. Football seems to be self-correcting to an extent: even Guardiola has said himself that he needs maverick dribblers to break up formulaic systems.

Fair point, but I wasn't referring to total perfection on all fronts. I was referring to what you're describing, something built with a particular purpose in mind and what happens as it becomes increasingly efficient, e.g. City cutting into the entertainment factor as they make fewer and fewer mistakes.

Imagine an actor so proficient there's no room for nuance and interpretation in their performance. That's the kind of perfection I'm talking about. The ideal being met so completely that a lot of what makes the form interesting is lost.

 

[mixed_biscuits]

Fair point, but I wasn't referring to total perfection on all fronts. I was referring to what you're describing, something built with a particular purpose in mind and what happens as it becomes increasingly efficient, e.g. City cutting into the entertainment factor as they make fewer and fewer mistakes.

Imagine an actor so proficient there's no room for nuance and interpretation in their performance. That's the kind of perfection I'm talking about. The ideal being met so completely that a lot of what makes the form interesting is lost.

Yeah, I'm saying it depends on what the ideal is and whether it's one-dimensional or not...we could just decide to call one-dimensional performances necessarily imperfect (this is already implied in the aim to hit more than one performance goal.

 

[Corpsey]

Not sure how GERMANE this is to this thread but I found it interesting

Philosopher R.G. Collingwood quoted in a biography of Cezanne I was leafing through last night:

"I learned to think of a picture not as a finished product exposed for the benefit of virtuosi, but as a visible record... of an attempt to solve a definite problem in painting, so far as the attempt had gone."

 

[version]

Not sure how GERMANE this is to this thread but I found it interesting

Philosopher R.G. Collingwood quoted in a biography of Cezanne I was leafing through last night:

"I learned to think of a picture not as a finished product exposed for the benefit of virtuosi, but as a visible record... of an attempt to solve a definite problem in painting, so far as the attempt had gone."

I remember reading somewhere that Anthony 'Shake' Shakir referred to every track he made as a failed experiment.

 

[Corpsey]

Coincidentally, Cezanne was known as Paul "Shake" Cezanne

 

[WashYourHands]

it's like recording a mix years ago with/without mates because it applied to them too

you'd get any records you thought warranted listening to more regularly for the next period of time, in-between buying, swapping etc and they'd all be lined up against walls and skirting boards out of their bags

you'd have a rough idea where you could take your own picks, all you'd have to do to dial up the neuroticism was add a couple more perfectionists like yourself and a time constraint

as soon as you put a blank cassette in the player and pressed red for record someone (anyone) would fluff the first mix, so you'd warm up a bit and the still the next 60 minutes wouldn't quite flow or the sequencing/pacing of selections was off or you forgot tracks by mistake after finishing "d'oh you missed x and y, dullard"

you could flip your pov and see it much more as piecing together a tune puzzle, how you could get navigate to get the best out of each piece even, say, as mixing 'tools', a term which is never appropriate referencing (snooker break is a better analogy), where each individual mix could be greater than the sum of its respective parts and just how many ways there are to transition and bridge between tracks = borderline limitless

not beat matching either, more the quest for flow and pacing perfection - just exactly right - except the only time said inspiration fired up fully (and it is inspiration) was when it was a live setting and you could collectively lean right into such sounds over countless hours at juiced up crispy chuggy volume and let it take on a momentum all of its own, something so far away from notions of perfection as to make the point moot

changing formats too - 60 or 90 mins cassettes, one hour 19mins cd's or 60 mins mini promo mixes (ffs), ok within limits yet to be able to collectively guide your way up through transcendence, each link in the chain inspiring everyone else, is a rare experience and art form

people differ beyond a certain threshold and, as it's Simon DK's memorial Weekend, I can't think of a more suitable candidate for playing THE finest picks available at any given period of time by creating individual moments of awe and wonder over and over, as opposed to the finer points of perfection in beat matching and losing any groove in the process