DUBSTEP- breaking news, gossip, slander, lies etc

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elgato

I just dont know
exclusivity doesn't benefit a scene in the long run, but certainly boosts the careers of djs that are in on the monopoly - at least thats the way it worked in jungle. i don't think thats the reason with dmz et al, but its still frustrating not being able to get this great music.

Its pure speculation of course, but I think that dmz have a very real understanding of the value (non-monetary of course!) that can be brought to their music through holding off releasing it. For example, the track Changes, in my opinion the most majestic, ethereal and defining dmz track, has never been released. I cant imagine that this is because they don’t think its good enough, nor that they just rate other tracks more highly. But because its never been released, and my primary memory of it is of darkened smoky rooms filled with bass pressure, it retains so much that might otherwise be lost if available on a tangible object available from all good retailers. For me, that track now actually embodies that whole time in the development of the music… the point where dmz, who I believe will be remembered as the dubstep crew, came into their own. And I think a lot of that magic would be lost if I had it in my hands on a mass-produced piece of plastic, being dropped by every sub-standard dj in the land. I would be genuinely disappointed if it was released now. And I think that there is an aspect of their thinking that while they want a lot of people to hear their music, they want to keep that impact and magic, at least for a few key tracks.

and we still have them on mixes
 

elgato

I just dont know
@theundisputedtruth

I really think that you’re underestimating the power of the subconscious as to your perceptions of music. You might not think it affects you, but im of the opinion that it definitely will affect you, whether in favour of an artist or against, whether you consciously think it or not.

I must stress that I only think that mala is Arabic from his looks, this hasnt been confirmed to me, so I might well be wrong. Why do you find that interesting? Does the new information change the way that you perceive his music?

As to the city cycle business, for a start I think that a different track would be better to discuss if im defending dmz as a whole! But that highlights an important point for me, which is that diversity is a very important thing to me in music. I want those tracks of breathtaking melodic or atmospheric beauty, those tracks with a more traditional “musical” approach, but I also want tracks like this which are pretty much just raw experimentation. It sounds like nothing I have ever heard before, and that means a lot to me. I have heard night bus, and I love burial, he’s clearly an incredible artist, but I don’t want everything to sound like burial, nor do I want all dubstep (or music) to be maximalist…for me there is great power in restraint.

Its quite interesting that burial is used in contrast here when he has publically stated that “musicianship is the enemy of my music”! but ive always found that a strange thing anyways.

I suppose that perhaps what it comes down to is that I would not restrict the term ‘music’ or ‘musical’ to traditional elements such as melodic interplay, chord structures, orchestration etc, but would see it more widely as simply the use of sound variation to evoke emotion (of any type).
 

bassnation

the abyss
Its pure speculation of course, but I think that dmz have a very real understanding of the value (non-monetary of course!) that can be brought to their music through holding off releasing it. For example, the track Changes, in my opinion the most majestic, ethereal and defining dmz track, has never been released. I cant imagine that this is because they don’t think its good enough, nor that they just rate other tracks more highly. But because its never been released, and my primary memory of it is of darkened smoky rooms filled with bass pressure, it retains so much that might otherwise be lost if available on a tangible object available from all good retailers. For me, that track now actually embodies that whole time in the development of the music… the point where dmz, who I believe will be remembered as the dubstep crew, came into their own. And I think a lot of that magic would be lost if I had it in my hands on a mass-produced piece of plastic, being dropped by every sub-standard dj in the land. I would be genuinely disappointed if it was released now. And I think that there is an aspect of their thinking that while they want a lot of people to hear their music, they want to keep that impact and magic, at least for a few key tracks.

and we still have them on mixes

well, it certainly runs counter to the (now prevailing) digital distribution ethos where every recording anyone has ever committed to vinyl is instantly available everywhere and i can see how this might increase the value - supply and demand etc.

i also accept that there are some tunes that feel "wrong" playing played on your hi fi after hunting them down when previously, you'd only ever heard them played in a dark basement. they feel too large to be captured in a home environment and i'm totally down with that.

however, i believe a good tune is a good tune, whether or not lots of people have it. the fact that lots of "sub-standard djs" (who are tomorrows generation of djs btw) have copies of midnight request line does not make it any less incredible as a piece.

theres been many jungle tunes which i've hunted down for years because the release was limited to a few hundred copies. thats cool and its part of the fun - but with dubstep its every other tune, and it gets tedious never being able to get hold of anything good bar a few morsels. and the idea of music being lost forever really, really bugs me.
 
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elgato

I just dont know
the idea of music being lost forever really, really bugs me.

i know what you mean, but its not lost forever, its on mixes

i agree as to represses of already released material, but dmz are repressing 003-007 to be fair to them, and its hard balancing the need to release as much new material as possible with represses
 

bassnation

the abyss
i know what you mean, but its not lost forever, its on mixes

i agree as to represses of already released material, but dmz are repressing 003-007 to be fair to them, and its hard balancing the need to release as much new material as possible with represses

i accept this but dance music revolves around making releases available for djs as well as mixes. some of us aren't happy until we've got that tune in our sweaty little hands!
 
I can fully relate to Burial's notion that “musicianship is the enemy of his music”. Not understanding music in a formally trained sense makes possible for the happy accident to occur. We musn't underestimate the role of serendipity and synchronicity in 'composing'.

With regards to Mala's ethnicity. It is only interesting in that I don't know of many middle eastern producers making contemporary music that isn't somehow linked to their first nation culture.

I'm not to sure about the conscious and subconscious colouring of artists perception impacting ones preference to their works. If a tune resonates an emotion with me I don't care who or what they have done, what they look like or where they come from. I don't see that should matter. You like it or you dont. It really is that simple, though with repeated listens you may change your opinion. I'd still hate to think my opinion is affected by such superficialities like those previously mentioned.
 

elgato

I just dont know
its not necessarily superficialities, you were talking about appreciating a piece within the context of an artistic progression... that isnt superficial.

one's expectations will inevitably affect your experience imo
 
Oh sorry, the superficialities i meant are who or what they have done, what they look like or where they come from.

I tend not to have expectations. I find they can ruin a decent experience ;)
 

elgato

I just dont know
but im questioning the possibility of having a complete vacuum of expectation! i just dont think its possible, no matter how you strive for it in your conscious thought. the way in which your brain processes information is inevitably coloured by experience. why do you think you can just snap off the influence of previously absorbed information where it gets to the point where you find it undesirable or inappropriate? do you believe in that degree of control over your mind? i certainly do not
 

elgato

I just dont know
well id assumed that but the "i think" which opened your statement brought a degree of confusion to the issue

what is his ethnicity?
 

Blackdown

nexKeysound
i dont speak for mala, you'd have to ask him, but i'm pretty sure your suggestion is inacurate. how would you feel if we were all talking about your parents on a global forum?
 

elgato

I just dont know
how would you feel if we were all talking about your parents on a global forum?

not that fussed to be honest, if those people meant me well and it came up incidentally to a broader discussion

but if there is the possibility that it would offend him then obviously i wont continue the discussion, clearly i have been insensitive in your eyes, and as you know him...
 

elgato

I just dont know
on reflection i would like to apologise to anyone concerned for discussing such an intimate issue, i hope that no offence or discomfort has been caused
 

UFO over easy

online mahjong
So are you saying that your reaction to a tune is coloured by a perception of the artist and the tunes rarely stand on their own merits or not ?

Yeah I am I guess.. but I don't think that's as big a problem as you make it sound.

Are you saying that you have complete control over your subconscious, to the extent that you can block out everything other than the music itself?
 

gabriel

The Heatwave
why is it insensitive to talk about a musician's ethnicity on a music forum?

just today on dissensus i came across a post about latin influences in techno, which led to a reference to the fact that ricardo villalobos and some other producer/dj are of latin american origin. no one jumped up and said 'how would you feel if we were all discussing your parents on a global music forum?'

why, in this instance, might it cause offence and require an apology?
 

elgato

I just dont know
i felt to apologise as on consideration i thought perhaps mala might feel uncomfortable with that discussion if he were to see it, as i do not know how different people's sensitivities lie

it had also become quite detached from the discussion from which it had originally sprung

i know what you mean, but at the end of the day i do want to have respect for artists' personal sphere as it were
 
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