Max 19 goes on holiday and tells you about it in the Guardian

[martin]

That quote from his dad, "this tsunami of hate", isn't the best terminology when your son's travelling to Thailand. I've lost sympathy for him after he claimed to be 'distraught', if you stick any writing in the public domain you have to expect the possibility of drawing flak.

 

[benjybars]

That quote from his dad, "this tsunami of hate", isn't the best terminology when your son's travelling to Thailand. I've lost sympathy for him after he claimed to be 'distraught', if you stick any writing in the public domain you have to expect the possibility of drawing flak.

the quote that "being young, bright and middle-class is considered a crime in this country" is the one that got me..

yeah, because there's so many obstacles in the way of bright young middle-class kids in modern britain.. if only your son was poor and working-class, then he'd have it easy!

dickhead.

having said that it must be rough to see your kid being bullied on the internet like that...

 

[vimothy]

Guardian readers do seem to hate themselves a bit, though (via Gogarty, in this case).

 

[Mr. Tea]

Guardian readers do seem to hate themselves a bit, though (via Gogarty, in this case).

I'm sure I've mentioned this on here before - there is a definite strain of middle-class guilt or self-loathing apparent in a lot of writing in the paper.

Hence:

the quote that "being young, bright and middle-class is considered a crime in this country" is the one that got me..

I don't think Gogarty Snr. is actually saying his son is 'disadvantaged' because of this - he's talking about the bilious inverted snobbery displayed so clearly in the comments people left.

 

[vimothy]

Guilt is exactly what it is, IMO.

 

[UFO over easy]

he's talking about the bilious inverted snobbery displayed so clearly in the comments people left.

and the posts of quite a few regular posters on this board, who are most probably just as priviledged.. no matter how e3 they may think they are

Guilt is exactly what it is, IMO.

definitely. I wrote something about this in the 'miserable' thread in misc... it's a particularly directionless guilt, which is what makes it kind of interesting. maybe the only way people feel they can target these feelings is to play class-fancy dress constantly..

 

[Mr. Tea]

It's not the class aspect of the gap-year-travelling idea that bothers me - I'm as middle class as you like - it's more the stunning lack of imagination it betrays. He's clearly going to go there and meet loads of people just like him - and even to the locals he interacts with, to the extent that he will at all, he'll just be Rich White Kid #23,673 they've met that year alone.

A mate of mine is touring South America at the moment - not the beaches of Rio, either, but the hinterland or Argentina and Bolivia, which I think is a much better idea if you want to see what another country is really like when it's not totally given over to the tourist industry.

 

[UFO over easy]

would you say that was the kids fault? or that a lack of imagination (from a 19 year old! shock horror) deserved 400 incredibly unpleasant personal attacks?

 

[Mr. Tea]

would you say that was the kids fault? or that a lack of imagination (from a 19 year old! shock horror) deserved 400 incredibly unpleasant personal attacks?

Not really, no - as you say, he's 19. I've got nothing against him going, I just don't want to read about it. The fault lies mainly with his dad (who, presumably, must have had something to do with encouraging him to serialise his experiences in a blog) and the paper for deciding to publish it. I guess it's unfortunate that he's had to take the brunt of the flack.

 

[vimothy]

Some of them were quite funny, but there's only so many allusions to Nathan Barley you can make before the whole thing becomes rather tedious.

 

[Pestario]

It's not the class aspect of the gap-year-travelling idea that bothers me - I'm as middle class as you like - it's more the stunning lack of imagination it betrays.

It's the privileging of this guy's experience when it is so banal and mundane that irks me. Thus starting the train of thought that it's only because he's middle class and daddy knows the right people that he's in the guardian whether it's true or not.

 

[UFO over easy]

It's the privileging of this guy's experience when it is so banal and mundane that irks me.

he only got there about a week ago. gap years are not by definition banal and mundane.

 

[IdleRich]

As far as I can work out, there are a few fair points (blog looks a bit rubbish, it seems clear that he got it because of his dad) and loads of unrelated and vicious attacks on the middle-class, public schools and who knows what else - mainly by the kind of people who probably stood behind the bullies at school agreeing with whatever they said.
On the second day when the Travel Editor guy did what was ostensibly a kind of explanation but really a justification it just carried on with more of the same and I can see why it annoyed people even more. Saying that Max's Dad was only an occasional writer is pretty lame and the fact that he changed his story regarding who contacted whom left me fairly convinced that the original conclusion of Daddy's boy getting the job was correct. That's the meat of the story and it is worth slapping down in my opinion. Most of the comments were bollocks but something about the outpouring of hate did still provide me with a lot of pleasure I'm sorry to say.

"or that a lack of imagination (from a 19 year old! shock horror) deserved 400 incredibly unpleasant personal attacks?"

No, of course not, and the more thoughtful complaints were rightfully aimed at the Guardian itself. I think that there is a story in there somewhere but a large part of the herd missed the important bit in their scramble to call him Nathan and mention his friends called Rupert and set him up with fake facebook accounts and the like.

 

[UFO over easy]

I guess the safest thing for us all to do would just be to sit at home on the internet day and night, with maybe the occasional coffee and toilet break for good measure.

It would probably reduce the chances of anyone setting a foot wrong, ever.

 

[Mr. Tea]

I dont know your friend,

Exactly. You're presuming quite a lot here:

but most of the time i loathe these types even more than Max. Max knows that what he does, millions have done befor him. But people like your mate often think they are real explorers, who know the world, and feel the need in every conversation to let everybody know they've been places, though in the city where they live, there are many places they would never go. No, to "explore" you have to travel half the world, it cant be around the corner.
Whether you like it or not, you are a tourist, and when travelling in the third world, to many people you represent an opportunity to make money, and other people simply are not interested in you. I'm not in the habit of speaking to all kinds of people who visit the place i live in (i have a job, and i like to spend time with family and friends), and i'm pretty sure that goes for most people everywhere. The "friends" you make on these far and away travels are either people who want to make money out of you, or people just like you, students (either native or tourists) whith a lot of time and a reasonable amount of money (the fact they speak english alone assures they are the better educated).

!

My friend is well aware he is a tourist - I said he's 'touring', so he is one, by definition - he certainly hasn't set himself up as an intrepid explorer or anything like that - he's just gone off to a far-flung part of the word because he was fed up with London and fancied a long trip. In fact he never even mentioned anything to me about going 'off the beaten track' - that was just my observation on the fact that he's chosen to go somewhere that isn't India/Thailand/Aus/NZ. I don't see that there's anything wrong with wanting to go to a bit of the world that isn't totally given over to providing services for European/American/Japanese tourists.

Edit:

tourism is fine by me, just dont pretend to be a traveller or explorer, wherever you go

which my friend hasn't, and I'm not doing so on his behalf, so chill, alright? All I'm saying is, there's more than one way to be a tourist.

 

[bassnation]

As Tom PR said, 100pc

But what happened to the guardian? Why is it a mecca for the disillusioned, the bitter and the broken?

A genuine question: how come the blogs, as they call them, are full up with right wing comments (check out the one supporting Hillary Clinton from a - GASP- feminist perspective today)? Have these cunts got nowhere better to go?

oh come on, the article was excruciating and if it was on an anon blog, no-one would give a toss, but for it to be published by the guardian, well journos have to be big enough to handle a bit of criticism (something they seem to be utterly startled by, having previously talked at their audience). its a big bad world out there and getting flamed on the net is the least of my fucking worries, put it that way.

plus some of the comments were hilarious, alright some weren't, but lets all get off that big high horse labelled self righteous. its a silly story which kept me amused for a while and hes hardly going to die of humiliation is he?

 

[UFO over easy]

all aside from the fact that for him, he probably is exploring. it's all relative maaan.

this is all tapping into something else that irritates. information is so easy to access that everyone is suddenly an expert on everything. all from the comfort of the sitting room. we have nothing left to learn from each other anymore, only inanimate objects. the resultant state of general jadedness, disinterest and lethergy is one of the most unattractive human traits imaginable.


- this smilie sums up the 21st century.

 

[Pestario]

he only got there about a week ago. gap years are not by definition banal and mundane.

I didn't mean in that sense. I'm sure he'll have lots of stories to tell his friends but will they be of sufficient interest to maintain a decent blog that is marketed to the wider public? Particularly a guardian reading, blogosphere literate audience? Guessing from his writing style I doubt it.

 

[bassnation]

all aside from the fact that for him, he probably is exploring. it's all relative maaan.

this is all tapping into something else that irritates. information is so easy to access that everyone is suddenly an expert on everything. all from the comfort of the sitting room. we have nothing left to learn from each other anymore, only inanimate objects. the resultant state of general jadedness, disinterest and lethergy is one of the most unattractive human traits imaginable.

man, its nearly spring, life cannot possibly be that bad.

 

[Mr. Tea]

i never said i dislike your friend, i said i often dislike people who make travels like he does, after which i described a typical "traveller". i do believe your friend is a nice guy,

Don't believe everything you read: he could be a complete cunt for all you know.