Iraq - Still, In Fact, Going On

[sufi]

this is rather interesting
http://www.jstor.org/stable/10.5615/neareastarch.78.3.0170#pdf_only_tab_contents

Abstract

This paper focuses on ISIS's recent destruction of archaeological heritage in Iraq and its (self-) representation in the global media. It is argued that the Islamic State's destruction of archaeological sites and museums as well as historical monuments and local shrines can be seen as a form of place-based violence that aims to annihilate the local sense of belonging, and the collective sense of memory among local communities, to whom the heritage belongs. It is also suggested that the Islamic State coordinates and choreographs these destructions as mediatic spectacles of violence aimed at objects and sites of heritage, which take place as re-enactments or historical performances that are communicated to us through ISIS's own image-making apparatus that utilizes advanced technologies of visualization and communication.

 

[sufi]

Lets see...

Under the guise of fighting IS, the Turks are bombing the Kurds and attacking them politically within Turkey, potentially starting another war. The Kurds are of course the most effective anti-IS force on the ground

France, the US, Australia and the UK are bombing IS in Syria & Iraq whilst also providing support and training to other non-IS rebel groups.

The Arab league, Qatar and the Saudis are arming various rebel groups and threatening direct intervention.

The Russians are now using the refugee crisis as an excuse to bomb the main threats to Assad from non-IS rebel groups, including CIA trained groups and supported by various East Europeans and the Chinese.

Iran & Hezbollah are offering technical and independent military support of Assad.

Neighbouring countries, including Jordan, Israel and Lebanon are all involved either directly or covertly.

Every other bunch of scumbags in the planet including Croatia and North Korea are either shipping arms to, or supporting one faction or another.

Practically all of these interventions are illegal under IL, except possibly, the Russians and their allies.

Presumably the 'plan' now is to wipe out opposition to Assad one way or another and allow him to step down with some kind of puppet government set up to manage a 'transition' to democracy and then deal with IS.

Undoubtedly the prospects of a descent into a regional and then global conflagration are far more realistic. This makes Lebanon look like a tea party.

What you didnt mention is that as the US/"West" are in de facto alliance with Iran due to their shared "stewardship" of Iraq, they are effectively both backing and bombing pretty much everyone.
Basically a warmonger's jamboree at the expense of us all

 

[droid]

What you didnt mention is that as the US/"West" are in de facto alliance with Iran due to their shared "stewardship" of Iraq, they are effectively both backing and bombing pretty much everyone.
Basically a warmonger's jamboree at the expense of us all

Yeah, sorry, you'd have to write a book to even begin to make sense of the mess.

This is good on putin: http://new.spectator.co.uk/2015/10/how-putin-outwitted-the-west/

Makes the point that a Russian backed Iranian intervention on the ground would put them in direct conflict with US forces.

 

[trza]

I love the smell of drone strikes in the morning.....

 

[droid]

Russian jet shot down by Turkey:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/li...urkish-planes-near-syrian-border-live-updates

 

[trza]

so are we back to 2003 with the UK and USA bombing the middle east as partners again?

 

[Slothrop]

(This from 2001...)

 

[droid]

A group of major human rights organizations – Physicians for Social Responsibility (US), Physicians for Global Survival (Canada), and International Physicians for the Prevention of Nuclear War (Germany) – conducted a study that sought “to provide as realistic an estimate as possible of the total body count in the three main war zones [Iraq, Afghanistan, and Pakistan] during 12 years of ‘war on terrorism’,” including an extensive review “of the major studies and data published on the numbers of victims in these countries”, along with additional information on military actions.

Their “conservative estimate” is that these wars killed about 1.3 million people, a toll that “could also be in excess of 2 million”. A database search by independent researcher David Peterson in the days following the publication of the report found virtually no mention of it. Who cares?

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...war-on-terror-noam-chomsky-masters-of-mankind

 

[craner]

"...said Noam Chomsky."

 

[craner]

Although, to be fair, about three quarters of that text is comprised of quotes. The rest is just connecting clauses and snippy asides.

 

[droid]

http://www.psr.org/news-events/press-releases/doctors-group-releases-startling-analysis.html

This publication highlights the difficulties in defining outcomes as it compares evaluations of war deaths in Iraq, Pakistan and Afghanistan. Even so, the numbers are horrific. The number of Iraqis killed during and since the 2003 U.S. invasion have been assessed at one million, which represents 5% of the total population of Iraq. This does not include deaths among the three million refugees subjected to privations.

 

[droid]

5% of the population. Another 15% converted into refugees. Destablisation of an entire region. The supreme war crime.

Considering you supported this atrocity, you should, perhaps be more circumspect in your comments about those who opposed it and were proved right.

 

[craner]

Body Count takes a clear and objective look at the various and often contradictory--reports of mortality in conflicts directed by the U.S. and allied forces in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan. The result is a fuller picture of the devastation and lethality to civilian non-combatants throughout these regions. Unfortunately, these deaths have been effectively hidden from our collective consciousness and consciences by political leaders seeking to pursue military solutions to complex global issues with little, if any, accountability.

Nice objective starting point from the 'Physicians for Social Responsibility', then.

 

[craner]

Considering you supported this atrocity, you should, perhaps be more circumspect in your comments about those who opposed it and were proved right.

Fair enough, I just can't understand why you post links to such garbage, though.

 

[droid]

Does petty sniping assuage your conscience?

Just imagine, 5% of the UK dead, another 15% displaced, seemingly endless conflict and destabilisation nearly 15 years later, all for nothing.

 

[droid]

Fair enough, I just can't understand why you post links to such garbage, though.

Because its true?

 

[droid]

I mean, you havent actually got an argument here other than 'waugh, Noam Chomsky' have you?

 

[craner]

Well, yes, but I'm not sure where to begin with you, though. You talk as if you know absolutely nothing about what has happened in the last 15 years.

 

[droid]

lol, and you act as if you have know absolutely nothing about Western intervention over the last 2 centuries.

Tell me, what would be an acceptable level of Iraqi civilian deaths in your eyes?

 

[droid]

Terrorism specialists Peter Bergen and Paul Cruickshank estimate that the Iraq war “generated a stunning sevenfold increase in the yearly rate of fatal jihadist attacks, amounting to literally hundreds of additional terrorist attacks and thousands of civilian lives lost; even when terrorism in Iraq and Afghanistan is excluded, fatal attacks in the rest of the world have increased by more than one-third”.

Now thats a surprise isnt it?