What is 'street' in relation to music?

[crackerjack]

Well, lots of the post above seem to be saying it's about the background of the people who make the music, more than the people listening to it.

Does that answer your question

No, because it's not that simple. I can think of two lairy Mancs - working class, urban - whose music is massively popular among their own kind and could be heard blaring out of cars, pubs, shops, everywhere (particularly after closing time), but no one ever called Oasis street. But an ex-drama school rapper like Tupac who spent years trying to fit into the caricature of a streetwise black thug, supposedly is.

 

[mms]

No, because it's not that simple. I can think of two lairy Mancs - working class, urban - whose music is massively popular among their own kind and could be heard blaring out of cars, pubs, shops, everywhere (particularly after closing time), but no one ever called Oasis street. But an ex-drama school rapper like Tupac who spent years trying to fit into the caricature of a streetwise black thug, supposedly is.

tupac got to drama school cos he was good at drama, his mother was a crack addict, alot of his family had a strong criminal background, there is obviously some mix between acting and real life with his thug thing but it's not like he was priviledged, just talented.

i think with oasis the music is far removed from its street elements, or any kind of concious evolution from the street, which is what street music to an extent thrives on it can't really be called street, oasis live the good life, doing sort of beatlesy stuff.

 

[crackerjack]

"i think with oasis the music is far removed from its street elements, or any kind of concious evolution from the street, which is what street music to an extent thrives on it can't really be called street, oasis live the good life, doing sort of beatlesy stuff."

So do a lot of the rappers who are deemed street.

 

[crackerjack]

btw, As I understand it Tupac's mum was a Black Panther activist who turned to crack late on. I know he wasn't brought up in the Hamptons, but nor was he born in a crackhouse. He has spoken about his concern that his background was somehow not hard enough, too 'soft' to be a real rapper. I think you can understand a lot of his later career from the character he played in Juice.

 

[Guybrush]

How about this?

‘Urban’ = ‘black music’
‘Street’ = gritty ‘black music’

 

[Mr. Tea]

In Germany they call black music 'Black Music'.
I.e. a club will advertise that it plays 'Techno, House, Black Music', for example.

 

[Guybrush]

In Germany they call black music 'Black Music'.
I.e. a club will advertise that it plays 'Techno, House, Black Music', for example.

Unfortunately, we have these two deformities as loan-words—complete with American pronunciation. When I point out urban’s racist origins, most people just shrug and tell me I’m being obnoxiously P.C.

 

[gumdrops]

cant we all just get along?

Ebony and ivory live together in perfect harmony
Side by side on my piano keyboard, oh lord, why dont we?
We all know that people are the same where ever we go
There is good and bad in evryone,
We learn to live, we learn to give
Each other what we need to survive together alive.

Ebony and ivory live together in perfect harmony
Side by side on my piano keyboard, oh lord why dont we?

Ebony, ivory living in perfect harmony
Ebony, ivory, ooh

We all know that people are the same where ever we go
There is good and bad in evryone,
We learn to live, we learn to give
Each other what we need to survive together alive.

Ebony and ivory live together in perfect harmony
Side by side on my piano keyboard, oh lord why dont we?

Ebony, ivory living in perfect harmony (repeat and fade)

 

[Mr. Tea]

Unfortunately, we have these two deformities as loan-words—complete with American pronunciation. When I point out urban’s racist origins, most people just shrug and tell me I’m being obnoxiously P.C.

Eh? I would hardly call 'urban music' a 'racist' term. Is it not the case that the vast majority of black Britons live in cities, while the countryside is almost entirely white?

 

[Guybrush]

Here is what Bill Brewster wrote in Jockey Slut:

What Does Urban Mean Again?
I hate divisions. I hate ghettos. I hate the way that companies and corporations market colour-coded music. Now the BBC is at it. (Originally appeared in Jockey Slut.)

The news that Radio 1 is planning to branch out into digital radio broadcasting should reassure most that – along with their excellent website – they are finally catching up with the rest of society. The news that one of the stations will be an as-yet-unnamed ‘urban’ station, frankly, should fill us with dread.
With inner cities, and in particular London, a tough battleground for broadcasters hoping to woo fickle 16-24 year olds to their wavelength, it’s obvious why they have opted for this approach. The BBC has been losing ground to the likes of Kiss and Choice (not to mention the myriad garage pirates broadcasting from a tower block near you), and this looks like an obvious way to bring them back into Auntie’s fold.

Let’s not beat about the bush here. When the BBC talks about ‘urban’, what it actually means is black and Asian. It’s a term purloined from American radio, where urban has long been the racial code for black and Latino in America, where racism is endemic and minority interests are frequently corralled into safe little ghettos on the edges of the mainstream.

In the late forties, Billboard introduced a chart that was the first time the existence of the many local black-oriented stations had been acknowledged. They called it the ‘race’ chart (it later coalesced into the rhythm and blues chart) and this idea that the musical interests of black and white people have somehow automatically always been separate became fixed in the industry’s head. Fortunately for us, radio airwaves don’t operate a colour bar and so many white kids heard black music for the first time in their lives and found out that they loved it. Not only that, but a group of white DJs that included Alan Freed and Sound Stage Seven owner John Richbourg began playing black music, something that was instrumental in helping it cross over into white markets.

While it would be foolish to think that we’ve never had the same problems as the United States, the speed with which we’ve integrated a bewildering array of nationalities into a (relatively) homogenous multicultural society is the most remarkable thing to happen to the UK in the past 20 years. Veteran DJ Chris Hill has even claimed (and not without foundation, either) that British youth’s long-standing affection for black American music may well have contributed to that integration.

So it’s a shame, then, that the barriers that have been battered down by aspirational black and white kids (and what other country in the world has produced so many multiracial bands?) are busily being re-erected by the Jocastas and Ruperts that still dominate BBC corridors. A radio station where the music played is based on the colour of an artist’s’ skin or listeners’ parentage? No thanks.

 

[gumdrops]

Eh? I would hardly call 'urban music' a 'racist' term. Is it not the case that the vast majority of black Britons live in cities, while the countryside is almost entirely white?

how does it work with music made by black southerners in the US then, who live in what are 'rural' areas? urban is just a term for people to say 'black music' without having to say it. i dont get it personally. ive prob said this before but if were okay with saying food is chinese, or indian, or italian, why is it such a problem to say music is black? okay, black isnt a nationality, and in that case, im fine with saying african american music, or jamaican music, but people just like to lump all that into one as 'urban' dont they?

 

[stelfox]

oh dear, der, dear... why has this fallen into a thing abour "urban" music, race and all the other stuff? street music is about people and place - people who make it, people who listen to it - not race.
it involves people of all races, religions and ages in its production and consumption and is not about putting things in boxes or corralling groups away from the white mainstream. positing oasis as "street" is a silly, hairsplitting counter argument that doesn't work in any way and you know that, really.
also, while bill brewster always strikes me a being a knowledgable, careful and, on the one occasion i met him very briefly, a thoroughly nice man, i don't think the jockey slut piece posted earlier is very good or that it had much of a point.
fuck, if i'm talking about black music, i'll come right out and call it black music (but when i'd ever really need to do that i don't know because that particular umbrella term ranges from hendrix to tv on the radio to sizzla, derrick may and sylvester), what we're talking about is music that really informs and soundtracks people's inner-city lives. it's just about the same thing as woebot's santy house idea, but a bit bigger, really.
1Xtra doesn't fuck anyone or keep them in their place, it simply provides a wider platform for the music i want to hear and allows it to be broadcast with diversity and depth, rather than cramming it all into two late-night hours three times a week.

 

[crackerjack]

I wouldn't dream of seriously claiming Oasis are street music, but then i wouldn't use the term as I think it has no currency any more.

It did, back when I first heard it, which might well have been for Morgan Khan's record label, which released music that could only be heard in public places since radio wouldn't play it and TV wouldn't show it. In these days of the internet, specialist stations and satellite channels showing grime videos tthat look like they've been filmed on mobile phones, it seems meaningless.

 

[Chris]

If you wanted to get really general about it, I think you can separate "street" music into three types... though of course sometimes there is some blending of these categories:

A) the hardcore, gritty, street-"realist" stuff... which supposedly reflects the harshness of inner-city/ghetto life (in a serious or cartoonish way): hardcore/gangsta rap, some dancehall, ragga-jungle, grime...
B) the "conscious," underground, positive, maybe soulful or spiritual, sometimes jazzy stuff: underground hip hop, J Dilla, Sizzla, etc...
C) the club-oriented, sexy, catchy, materialistic, bling stuff: most if not all current mainstream hip hop

...and each of these schools would make claim to being the real "street" music too.


On a side note, another constant characteristic of "street" music, is that it's scene-oriented as opposed to solo artist/singular band-oriented... Actually, let me rephrase that... because there are singular mc's, producers, djs, etc that certainly stand out... but they do all seem to work much more collectively, and toward a more collective vision than most middle or upper-class rockist artists... not to say that all music that evolves collectively as a scene is "street."

 

[crackerjack]

If you wanted to get really general about it, I think you can separate "street" music into three types... though of course sometimes there is some blending of these categories:

A) the hardcore, gritty, street-"realist" stuff... which supposedly reflects the harshness of inner-city/ghetto life (in a serious or cartoonish way): hardcore/gangsta rap, some dancehall, ragga-jungle, grime...
B) the "concious," underground, positive, maybe soulful or spiritual, sometimes jazzy stuff: underground hip hop, J Dilla, Sizzla, etc...
C) the club-oriented, sexy, catchy, materialistic, bling stuff: most if not all current mainstream hip hop

...and each of these schools would make claim to being the real "street" music too.


On a side note, another constant characteristic of "street" music, is that it's scene-oriented as opposed to solo artist/singular band-oriented... Actually, let me rephrase that... because there are singular mc's, producers, djs, etc that certainly stand out... but they do all seem to work much more collectively, and toward a more collective vision than most middle or upper-class rockist artists... not to say that all music that evolves collectively as a scene is "street."

This the best definition I've seen yet, but what about other genres that are producer-oriented? And why do you only cite ragga-jungle rather than the more racially mixed jungle scenes?
Why do you only see black music as street?

 

[Chris]

This the best definition I've seen yet, but what about other genres that are producer-oriented? And why do you only cite ragga-jungle rather than the more racially mixed jungle scenes?
Why do you only see black music as street?

I singled out ragga-jungle in particular, not for necessarily being the most "street" sub-genre of jungle/dnb, but for of it's overt street imagery; dancehall and hip hop samples, gun blasts, roughneck posturing, it's "street realism" in stoic, screw-faced contrast to the more escapist, whimsical rave hardcore that came before...

Regarding my only listing black music in my assessment, I actually didn't realize that I did when I wrote the list. I guess I'd include reggaeton in the third category, and baille funk as C with a little bit of A (?), but in general, I think that "street" usually refers to current black music, because this usage of the term originated in hip hop, so it describes qualities that pertain more to black working class music than say... white working class music like heavy metal or country.

 

[swears]

Rip Js

Here is what Bill Brewster wrote in Jockey Slut:

I miss Jockey Slut, sure it was full of articles by soul-boy snobs and trainspotters, but still miles ahead of the bland megabranded hedonism of Mixmag and Ministry.

 

[Logan Sama]

Blackdown, I have to retract that statement then. Props to 1xtra for getting Edu in. They could still do with a Jazz show though.

And I double dog dare anyone to tell me I play Black music.

 

[demonrail666]

Street is surely just a name for music that enjoys (at least within the UK) a largely black/asian/working class/inner city following and which is thought to be produced by people whose origins, concerns and aspirations reflect those of that community.

 

[Tactics]

I have problems with 1Xtra

Blackdown, I have to retract that statement then. Props to 1xtra for getting Edu in. They could still do with a Jazz show though.

And I double dog dare anyone to tell me I play Black music.

but I applaud the BBC (apart from the snide s*** they get up to on the box) for having the modern day balls to put 'BLACK' in the title of something affliated with them and not retracting it

ppl are very very scared by the title 'Black Music' and have been for some times - I don't find it amazing

Sama...you play BLACK music - get the FOH and deal with it (which you won't anyway cos we've been through all this before)