i posted this in the other thread but just in case -
The English obsession with class is primarily cultural, yes.
Middle-class is a pretty empty term at this point. Incidentally, the lady who wrote the Standard article writes elsewhere that for her "despite being the epitome of middle middle class (doctor's daughter, grammar-school girl, boho provincial upbringing), being mistaken for a posho has been a lifetime affliction."
the lady doth protest a bit much... no one likes being boxed in and yeah, im sure there are people affecting poshness who actually arent (though isnt poshness more than just an accent - its about a certain demeanour or behaviour) but toff bashing often seems to be more like light ribbing than chav bashing to me. or maybe ive just not read enough toff bashing bile to compare.
Hannah Betts' latest piece, hot on the heels of moaning about being considered posh, is about how she likes wearing fur despite being a vegetarian.
chavs 'take holidays' the middle class spend summers at X
Well I was thinking mainly of 'the professions' - you know, schoolmasters, doctors, dentists, lawyers and other senior law professionals, accountants, civil servants, academics of course, members of the clergy - even in the 19th century, many of those jobs would probably have required at least an undergraduate degree, wouldn't they?
Oi, I just took a holiday! You calling me a chav? I'll fuckin av ya, ya cunt.
In the 19th Century, middle class houses were overfilled with furniture and 'knick-knacks.' In the latter part of the 20th century, working class households became like that. In the 19th century, oysters were a working-class food. In the 20th, a middle class delicacy. Wholemeal bread was considered to be working class food until 1865 in England, whereas it's definitely a middle-class thing now. These changes in tastes are not new.
Not really, no. I was taught by an English teacher without a degree in the 1990s, lawyers and accountants certainly did not require undergraduate degrees, dentistry wasn't really a profession in the 19th century, civil servants would mostly have been to college (e.g. East India Company College) and not university. Again, you're talking about the 1860s like they were the 1960s.
Hmmm, couple of issues with this:Food is always an interesting class meter. Oysters and Stout, pig hooves and cheeks, and all that shite used to be a poor blokes dish - Oysters took the turn earlier but now off cuts are all the rage in gastro-pubs....... further to this you see an impending backlash against all this wholesome obsession..... through out the 90's and 00 one class binged on (or still do, I dunno) processed junk - now we have heston peddling highly processed food to the middle classes.... (albeit with slightly fancier ingredients and more on point flavour compositions)...... mmmm, the heston gourmet burger (if there is one) is pretty much the culmination of these trains - a coagulation of taking what was once a paupers cut and a paupers gastronomy and re-selling it to the next class up - sheer Re-Capitalisation, marvellous shit no doubt.
Well, whatever. I'm not a social historian, obviously. But how likely is it that someone born into a working-class family and attending a state school (to the extent that they even existed in those days - when was free universal education introduced, anyway?) would have ended up in one of those professions I listed? Class mobility was pretty limited in Britain until the (19)60s, wasn't it?