qwerty south
no use for a witticism
noticed that one of the links in my previous post was broken so found the archived version:
Culture As Advertising.
Corpsey
bandz ahoy
I was thinking about this (not deeply, as I was pissed) the other day cos I went into the office for someone's leaving do. I rarely go in. The team is mostly people younger than me, mid to late 20s. They had a playlist on in the office and it was SO BLAND. And then we went to this pub and inside the pub they were playing music which was also SO BLAND.
I'd say much of it was faintly disco derived, generic funky basslines, possibly post bruno mars background music.
And because I'd heard both those things on the same day I thought maybe this is what music 'is' for a lot of people now, it's something 'chilled' in the background that you have on when you're working or out drinking. It's very much tied in with Spotify and those services, a spotify playlist called 'Chilled to the max' or whatever.
Perhaps ever was it thus. But I sort of feel the same draining of actual meaning and significance from a lot of the less poppy, more 'urban' music too. As usual could just be that i'm almost 40 now so naturally Central Cee is going to appeal to me less than to an 18 year old.
But 'airbrushed' is good here, too. The rough edges removed. I was thinking in that other thread where dilbert was saying he likes that band that sounds like 90s shoegaze, maybe if 'da kids' really are into that stuff then it's a sort of reaction to the unbearable smoothness of so much of the music that's now so mainstream. Not a particularly great reaction, and maybe it's all of a piece with it, cos it's close to ambient, it's lacking a genuine pulse.
shakahislop
Well-known member
I've said it before on here but my take on this is that some of the functions that music used to fulfill have been replaced by other cultural forms. Particularly things like music being a source of identity, something that you can passionately cling to, being a vessel for your own hopes and ambitions, feeling 'seen' by lyrics, music as a transmission mechanism for ideas and lifestyles. That is to say, a lot of the aspects of music that gave it meaning and significance.
I think everyone gets a bit blinded by thinking that the place of music in culture is always going to be the same as what it was from the 70s to the mid-2010s. More and more that looks like something temporary and contingent, and we've moved past it. Coz the communications environment is totally different.
Corpsey
bandz ahoy
One of the reasons I found bronx drill stuff exciting (for a few weeks lol) was that it was absolutely not something you could have playing in an office or a craft beer pub, it sounds messy and amateurish, its massively antisocial, it's a bloody racket. You can't imagine hearing that stuff even in JD Sports.
I think some of it is a byproduct of being "into" off-track London radio music & club environments as well, though; for the most part mainstream music has always been pretty straight and bland, outside of a lot of rap/r&b in the 90s/00s
It's hard to adjust getting older and out of that music/those scenes and just going back to the basic pub environments, or the standard spotify/apple playlists that they feed you. You want the inventiveness of what you've been raised on but it doesn't really exist unless you're still part of the underground scenes and who can be arsed with that now
It's hard to adjust getting older and out of that music/those scenes and just going back to the basic pub environments, or the standard spotify/apple playlists that they feed you. You want the inventiveness of what you've been raised on but it doesn't really exist unless you're still part of the underground scenes and who can be arsed with that now
shakahislop
Well-known member
actually UK rap at the moment, not that it's particularly my kind of thing, really has that affective/personality/confessional thing going on.
luka
Well-known member
there's a strong argument to say that it's the worst music in the world
A lot of UK rap is in a horrible state tbh but it has also been co-opted into the same old industry mechanism that they're all in. 90% of the "big" tapes coming out are fake independents or big label distro, loads of really obvious placements, the likes of Aitch being treated like something credible lol
Just been commodified really
Potter Payper tape was great tho i will defend that happily
Just been commodified really
Potter Payper tape was great tho i will defend that happily
shakahislop
Well-known member
there is something denuded about it. it's massive though. people think Dave could headline glastonbury next year.
shakahislop
Well-known member
its kind of passed without comment i think (in what i read anyway) but the new uk rap thing is presumably the successor to the shit / second wave of grime from 2015ish, where suddenly normie kids were sitting in gloucester green playing boy better know off thier phones.
version
Well-known member
The “Disney adult” industrial complex
The grown-up Disney superfan has become a much-mocked phenomenon online. But creating these consumers was always part of the corporation’s plan.
www.newstatesman.com
dilbert1
Well-known member
As a child I also had the full Winnie the Pooh bedspread, along with Hercules dinner plates and countless books and toys, grew up watching all the late 90s ‘Renaissance’ period VHSs, and my mom even worked briefly at an official Disney Store at the mall around the time Mulan came out. She’s from Orlando so when visiting family we’d go to the park with tickets my uncle scored one way or the other, I’ve probably been about four times altogether.
The parks are interesting, I went back to Universal Studios in Orlando when I was 25 and its a very similar experience, but being there at an older age was much more eerie. The heightened simulation of real natural places in the rides (especially weird in what’s called a ‘dark’ or ‘ghost’ ride where its contained inside/underground), high-end animatronics, holographic projections and detailed environments along the lines of major IP buried deep in my child-brain (Men in Black, for instance), were all much easier to see through as constructed versus when I was young, but it all still had a distinct power to it, the sheer amount of work put into everything, appearances from the actors and contrived sidebars from the movies, its officialdom and potency in the cultural memory, the sophistication of illusion and the unbelievably massive scale of the place. In the case of Disney World, the thousands of acres of real wetland it sits on, the multiple zoos, the streets and fake cities, the castle, the sounds and smells they surreptitiously pump into the air and optical tricks to further enhance your experience.
The stories of people dying in the park have always creeped me the fuck out, which seems a common reaction and there are plenty of Youtube videos capitalizing on the juxtaposition of horror within “the happiest place on Earth.” I had a high school history teacher who used to work at the Anaheim park, probably in the 80s, and he told us about people sneaking off trying to swim across the man-made rivers and drowning, decapitations on rides, going off where they weren’t supposed to ‘behind the scenes’ and getting trapped or falling multiple stories. Something about losing your life in a constructed world like that is objectively terrifying.
One of the wildest things is Walt’s original vision for EPCOT, the ‘Experimental Planned Community of Tomorrow’. He got carried away trying to make part of the park a real place where people would live, with housing, transport, agriculture and the works, his grandiose modernist hubris really shining through, apparently to the discomfort of his colleagues. Even though everyone who worked for him knew they’d can the original idea once he passed, they still let him make this promotional film for it in 1966, and from what I remember he held onto implementing the idea until his dying day, which was only months later:
This youtube documentary gets into the details of the whole story, including the insane logistics, and is worth a watch:
As the article highlights well, the man, his company and its characters and products are testaments to the truly God-like power of media. It feels synonymous with 20th century America, especially from the ‘30s through the ‘60s, but its massive and seemingly uninterrupted comeback since the late ‘80s and ‘90s proves its permanence in the national psyche. Clearly what little remains today of a monoculture alters its former significance, but it still dominates, and perhaps as never before considering the way it has adapted by absorbing so much other mass entertainment.
The parks are interesting, I went back to Universal Studios in Orlando when I was 25 and its a very similar experience, but being there at an older age was much more eerie. The heightened simulation of real natural places in the rides (especially weird in what’s called a ‘dark’ or ‘ghost’ ride where its contained inside/underground), high-end animatronics, holographic projections and detailed environments along the lines of major IP buried deep in my child-brain (Men in Black, for instance), were all much easier to see through as constructed versus when I was young, but it all still had a distinct power to it, the sheer amount of work put into everything, appearances from the actors and contrived sidebars from the movies, its officialdom and potency in the cultural memory, the sophistication of illusion and the unbelievably massive scale of the place. In the case of Disney World, the thousands of acres of real wetland it sits on, the multiple zoos, the streets and fake cities, the castle, the sounds and smells they surreptitiously pump into the air and optical tricks to further enhance your experience.
The stories of people dying in the park have always creeped me the fuck out, which seems a common reaction and there are plenty of Youtube videos capitalizing on the juxtaposition of horror within “the happiest place on Earth.” I had a high school history teacher who used to work at the Anaheim park, probably in the 80s, and he told us about people sneaking off trying to swim across the man-made rivers and drowning, decapitations on rides, going off where they weren’t supposed to ‘behind the scenes’ and getting trapped or falling multiple stories. Something about losing your life in a constructed world like that is objectively terrifying.
One of the wildest things is Walt’s original vision for EPCOT, the ‘Experimental Planned Community of Tomorrow’. He got carried away trying to make part of the park a real place where people would live, with housing, transport, agriculture and the works, his grandiose modernist hubris really shining through, apparently to the discomfort of his colleagues. Even though everyone who worked for him knew they’d can the original idea once he passed, they still let him make this promotional film for it in 1966, and from what I remember he held onto implementing the idea until his dying day, which was only months later:
This youtube documentary gets into the details of the whole story, including the insane logistics, and is worth a watch:
As the article highlights well, the man, his company and its characters and products are testaments to the truly God-like power of media. It feels synonymous with 20th century America, especially from the ‘30s through the ‘60s, but its massive and seemingly uninterrupted comeback since the late ‘80s and ‘90s proves its permanence in the national psyche. Clearly what little remains today of a monoculture alters its former significance, but it still dominates, and perhaps as never before considering the way it has adapted by absorbing so much other mass entertainment.
dilbert1
Well-known member
As for the thrust of the article, I somewhat appreciated the empathic angle, wouldn’t want to victim-blame in terms of people’s psychologies and sense of agency being manipulated by capitalism, and am likewise turned off by the low-hanging-fruit mocking contempt in which that type is held by those who fancy themselves more mature but who are inevitably also culturally compromised in innumerable ways by similar forces. The bit about the girl’s deceased grandpa loving Goofy was humanizing, I have to admit. But I’d be lying if I didn’t think flaunting it the way some of them do is unseemly and some personal responsibility shouldn’t be at play in transcending your own stunted development.
This line I also found a little bit naive (or disingenuous) on the author’s part. Obviously no one, not even Disney had to lie to them about what they ought to do, conditions have more or less necessitated people act like consumers, the parks and products just provide an effective and very comprehensive outlet for exactly that kind of collective relief. I’m reminded of that Adorno line I quoted about Donald Duck, its more of a reinforcement thing.
This line I also found a little bit naive (or disingenuous) on the author’s part. Obviously no one, not even Disney had to lie to them about what they ought to do, conditions have more or less necessitated people act like consumers, the parks and products just provide an effective and very comprehensive outlet for exactly that kind of collective relief. I’m reminded of that Adorno line I quoted about Donald Duck, its more of a reinforcement thing.
dilbert1
Well-known member
Speaking of which, Walter Benjamin penned an unpublished fragment about Mickey Mouse, comprised of brief thoughts he jotted after discussing the character in 1931 with Dutch art historian Gustav Glück and the composer/Brecht collaborator Kurt Weill:
Property relations in Mickey Mouse cartoons: here we see for the first time that it is possible to have one's own arm, even one's own body, stolen. […]
In these films, mankind makes preparations to survive civilization.
Mickey Mouse proves that a creature can still survive even when it has thrown off all resemblance to a human being. He disrupts the entire hierarchy of creatures that is supposed to culminate in mankind.
These films disavow experience more radically than ever before. In such a world, it is not worthwhile to have experiences.
Similarity to fairytales… All Mickey Mouse films are founded on the motif of leaving home in order to learn what fear is.
So the explanation for the huge popularity of these films is not mechanization, their form; nor is it a misunderstanding. It is simply the fact the public recognizes their life in them.
Hard to imagine what watching an animated cartoon was like for people nearly a hundred years ago now. Especially under the influence of Marxism, impending Nazi rule, and that good Weimar hashish!
Property relations in Mickey Mouse cartoons: here we see for the first time that it is possible to have one's own arm, even one's own body, stolen. […]
In these films, mankind makes preparations to survive civilization.
Mickey Mouse proves that a creature can still survive even when it has thrown off all resemblance to a human being. He disrupts the entire hierarchy of creatures that is supposed to culminate in mankind.
These films disavow experience more radically than ever before. In such a world, it is not worthwhile to have experiences.
Similarity to fairytales… All Mickey Mouse films are founded on the motif of leaving home in order to learn what fear is.
So the explanation for the huge popularity of these films is not mechanization, their form; nor is it a misunderstanding. It is simply the fact the public recognizes their life in them.
Hard to imagine what watching an animated cartoon was like for people nearly a hundred years ago now. Especially under the influence of Marxism, impending Nazi rule, and that good Weimar hashish!
version
Well-known member
No-clipping out of Disneyland.
