IdleRich

IdleRich
it happens, but not as often as you claim. you're talking like it happens every other possession.
I'll be the first to admit I've no idea of the frequency of occurrence. The videos seem to imply it's all the time... but again, that quite possibly goes back to old gits moaning about how it's not like it was back in the day
 

sus

Moderator
Top post or r/NBA today is more ref controversy, which has been one of the big stories of the year (even tho it's always controversial)

L2M = last two minutes of the game—the league issues a scorecard for its officiating during crunch time

 

IdleRich

IdleRich
To me it's a subject that is fascinatingly exotic... basketball (probably US sports in general) are in an uncanny valley where they resemble sports as I know them but have these small differences in culture and approach that are particularly highlighted precisely because of the similarities.
 
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linebaugh

Well-known member
The refs are the worst part of the NBA. Its not entirely their fault because basketball is the toughest sport to officiate, but it seems clear that theyre the worst across all major american leagues.

with the current freedom of movement approach the league has towards calling games, I dont think its possible to consistently perceive what players are doing at their average speed now. its an impossible task. so youve got the refs relying more on feel/ flow of the game/aesthetics to make calls and thus calls feel more arbitrary and inconsistent.
 
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linebaugh

Well-known member
that and the last two minute report and limitations of the coaches challenge seem to be why the refs have been particularly maligned this season
 
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IdleRich

IdleRich
The refs are the worst part of the NBA. Its not entirely their fault because basketball is the toughest sport to officiate, but it seems clear that theyre the worst across all major american leagues.

with the current freedom of movement approach the league has towards calling games, I dont think its possible to consistently perceive what players are doing at their average speed now. its an impossible task. so youve got the refs relying more on feel/ flow of the game/aesthetics to make calls and thus calls feel more arbitrary and inconsistent.
Refereeing is so difficult. Sometimes I got roped into officiating for five-a-side games when I played in a fairly casual league and for whatever reason the guy who was supposed to do it didn't show. A totally thankless task where you do your best to make the right decisions without bias and yet every single time you blow the whistle both sets of players lay into you with the harshest insults imaginable (exactly as I did when playing).

I've also read that offside is demonstrably literally impossible for any one person to call correctly with any degree of certainty when the player passing the ball and the most advanced attacker are far enough apart to make the angle separating them bigger than a certain value as the eye simply can't see both positions with the requisite precision.

Luckily you don't have offside in small sided games but it was plenty hard enough even so.
 

linebaugh

Well-known member
What does @linebaugh think of the deal?
Not sure what to think. Could be really good could be really bad. I think the mavs need to consider going all in and trade for og anuoby if they can because Im reasonably confident that it will at least go ok for the reminder of this season due to the initial honeymoon phase and kyrie still playing for a max with free agency looming.

Assuming hardaway and wood leave in any further deals:

Luka, kyrie, OG, josh green, maxi kleber, bullock, dwight powell isnt championship level but could still make it out of the west this year.
 

linebaugh

Well-known member
A luka, kyrie, green, og, kleber small ball lineup would absolutely shred teams but wed still need more depth and a true big man. If we cant get OG Id like to see if the mavs can make a deal for Zubac without giving up another first round pick
 
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padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
Terrible deal, like possibly Gobert to Minnesota (a potentially all-time awful trade) level bad, possibly worse. Mavs didn't give up as much in future assets but 1) I think the of locker room cancers is often overrated but in Kyrie's case it is 100% justified - he's a franchise killer with an impossibly long and terrifying record of ruining teams with his bullshit. This is the 4th front office to think "no we're the ones that can change him/rein him in", good luck with that. 2) it doesn't even make sense basketball-wise. The Mavs needed better secondary ball handlers who don't need the ball all the time. That has never been Kyrie, who overlaps with Luka too much for them both to be fully effective at the same time. Also, an already bad defensive team just got rid of its best defender. Good luck even slowing down big wings now.

Assuming Kyrie doesn't just blow it up with his nonsense - a big assumption since he's done exactly that to his last two teams - they still gave up two solid pieces and draft picks for a trade that -at best- doesn't put them any closer to contention. Terrible.
 

padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
If they made a further trade for OG Anunoby (with what remaining assets tho?) as linebaugh suggested at least u could see a coherent basketball plan I guess, tho the everpresent threat of Kyrie nonsense would still loom just as large
 

sus

Moderator
All-time awful trade? Padraig honestly, what are you smoking. Timberwolves are doing well recently, and half a season isn't enough time to tell whether team a team will click. And when you consider how well the Jazz are doing, or recent trade atrocities like Harden for Simmons, I don't know how you can defend such a reactionary claim as a basketball fan
 

sus

Moderator
If Wolves fail to make a conference finals with the twin towers I'll agree that it was a bad call to throw all those firsts away. Let's give it a bit of time
 

linebaugh

Well-known member
it could be the trade that loses us luka which would indeed make it one of the worst trades ever, Im not exactly confident. That being said I think it definitely works basketball wise. Kyrie can just slot into what Brunson did last year, which in the playoffs was standard your turn my turn iso basketball with two high usage guys. Brunson had a 28% usage rate in the playoffs last year, and Kyrie this year has a 30% usage rate. Theres some noise because Luka missed 3 playoff games, but regardless I dont see how the difference cant be split for Kyrie who is better than brunson.

Kyries also worked well with lebron and harden who Luka is most stylistically similar too. Not denying Kyrie isnt a franchise killer but for whatever reason the players all love him and he doenst seem to have a problem being a number two, or at least a 1b.

And this hasnt leaked out to the rest of the league yet, but dorian finney smith has not been our best perimeter defender this year. Thats been josh green. Albeit putting trust in a 22 year old is another major risk, but the defensive core of Bullock, DFS, and Kleber is still in tact with Green sliding into the DFS slot. DFS is one of my favorite Mavs ever but Green might be better than him all around right now and Id be pretty surprised if he isnt next season. Also worth noting that the primary reason the mavs defense has been so bad is because Kleber has been injured, and he'll be back around the all star break.
 
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