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There was that uncomfortable episode a few years back where they decided to support an academic who'd been accused of stalking and sexually harassing a grad student then had to walk it back a few months later and apologise.
Judith Butler and the new identity politics?
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Clinamenic
Binary & Tweed
Haha I remember Zizek talking about this, saying how the student was emotionally manipulative and was really the one to blame.
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Yeah, he claimed he knew the allegations were false but he couldn't say anything about them and that anything she may or may not have done was just her "eccentricities,".
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You read that recent article on him and the effect he was having on teenage boys and their parents?
I can believe it, but it also reads like the author may have made some of it up and attributed it to fictional people. This feels like someone taking the piss,
As Tate was blowing up, Ruby made the connection and grew concerned — even more so when Charlie told her that Tate was being interviewed on Tucker Carlson and suggested they watch together. She and her husband said “no.” “I’m like a Brooklyn, far-left person. If Tucker Carlson interviewed Barack Obama, who’s probably my favorite person on earth, I wouldn’t watch that,” she says.
william_kent
Well-known member
You read that recent article on him and the effect he was having on teenage boys and their parents?
I can bellieve it, but the article also read like the author had made a lot of it up and attributed it to fictional people they'd "interviewed". This reads like someone taking the piss,
As Tate was blowing up, Ruby made the connection and grew concerned — even more so when Charlie told her that Tate was being interviewed on Tucker Carlson and suggested they watch together. She and her husband said “no.” “I’m like a Brooklyn, far-left person. If Tucker Carlson interviewed Barack Obama, who’s probably my favorite person on earth, I wouldn’t watch that,” she says.
not read that, but will probably click on the link once I've clicked on "post reply"
edit; I've seen a few youtube videos recently about youtube "influencers" who have been "red pilled" and fallen under the spell of the rapist* Tate ( i.e, Aiden Ross, Sneako ) and that Tate gimp is POISON, I hope he rots in jail
* normally I would prefix "allegedly" to avoid legal difficulties, but here I'm prepared to just say that the guy is an out and out rapist, makes me ashamed to have been AMAB
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Yeah, they're mentioned in the article. Apparently he'd use them as gateways to draw in more boys and ended up with loads of them all marketing his weird businesses for him.
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I think they're essentially saying things are more fluid than previously thought and change over time.
william_kent
Well-known member
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
Ah yes, the noted socialist firebrand Barack Obama, beloved of 'far-left people' everywhere.You read that recent article on him and the effect he was having on teenage boys and their parents?
I can believe it, but it also reads like the author may have made some of it up and attributed it to fictional people. This feels like someone taking the piss,
As Tate was blowing up, Ruby made the connection and grew concerned — even more so when Charlie told her that Tate was being interviewed on Tucker Carlson and suggested they watch together. She and her husband said “no.” “I’m like a Brooklyn, far-left person. If Tucker Carlson interviewed Barack Obama, who’s probably my favorite person on earth, I wouldn’t watch that,” she says.
william_kent
Well-known member
I can't take credit for this, someone else on this forum must have mentioned the irony of some idiot like Tate pontificating on "Red pill" ideology and "The Matrix" which was actually the creation of the Wachowskis ( gender trouble in full effect? )
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It's a common talking point. I'm sure it's incredibly frustrating for the Wachowskis to have had their work co opted like it has been too.
william_kent
Well-known member
anyway, what I'm trying to say is that Andrew Tate is "performative", an insecure "male" who is acting out his conception of "masculinity" and inadvertently proving Judith's theorem
I can, but it's not worth it. Cos you're presenting it in bad faith.
And also, I don't wish to defend Butler, as I am not a liberal.
I concede that much of what Butler wrote in the early 90s seems like common sense now. But that shows her works lasting relevance and value. We live in a world where identity has splintered into different populations, each seemingly autonomous and self-defined. I do want to adapt Butler's work to a more radical Marxist politics, but that's another project.
Right now, my project consists in my opposition to guys like Andrew Tate! I want to promote femininity while remaining in the context of male heterosexuality. Hypermasculine movements scare me. It would be cool if some community existed where men promote defiance to gender norms, but alas, no such den of gender trouble exists. Hence I'm stuck wandering the internet looking for people to listen to me talk about Judith Butler. Because in Butler lurks the true antidote to Andrew Tate: a movement as far in the opposite direction as possible, men embracing femininity. I believe Butler says in an interview that heterosexual men can use androgyny to mitigate their own toxic masculinity, but I can't find the source.
And for people who find Butler too difficult or downright bad at writing, I've always enjoyed her writing, dense and tough to parse as it can be. It has an unusual, somewhat awkward poetry to it.If she is a bad writer and analytic philosophers are good writers, then I would rather be a bad writer.
Right now, my project consists in my opposition to guys like Andrew Tate! I want to promote femininity while remaining in the context of male heterosexuality. Hypermasculine movements scare me. It would be cool if some community existed where men promote defiance to gender norms, but alas, no such den of gender trouble exists. Hence I'm stuck wandering the internet looking for people to listen to me talk about Judith Butler. Because in Butler lurks the true antidote to Andrew Tate: a movement as far in the opposite direction as possible, men embracing femininity. I believe Butler says in an interview that heterosexual men can use androgyny to mitigate their own toxic masculinity, but I can't find the source.
And for people who find Butler too difficult or downright bad at writing, I've always enjoyed her writing, dense and tough to parse as it can be. It has an unusual, somewhat awkward poetry to it.If she is a bad writer and analytic philosophers are good writers, then I would rather be a bad writer.
william_kent
Well-known member
Clinamenic
Binary & Tweed
Yeah I personally wouldn't say she's a bad writer, but this discourse (I've come to believe) is only intelligible to a small subset of humans who dedicate enough time to learning the theoretical language necessary to understand it. I also think its easy to let oneself get carried away in building upon one's own (already esoteric) personal language, and to forget the importance of being able to communicate to as many people as possible.
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Does it have to be one or the other? I'm a man and I don't want to be like Andrew Tate or androgynous/feminine.