your top ten films (?)

[IdleRich]

If I was doing this list now I might include Carnival of Souls which I watched for the first time the other day and thought was brilliant and have been recommending to everyone I know ever since. Even though it's obvious what the ending is going to be that doesn't matter because it adds a scary sense of inevitability - you just know she's fucked. The bit when she's driving through the desert at night and a face appears at the side window had particular resonance for me because if I drive alone at night I always start worrying about there being somebody hiding in the back seat or whatever. A ghostly face keeping pace with the car would be something else though...

 

[Octopus?]

If I was doing this list now I might include Carnival of Souls which I watched for the first time the other day and thought was brilliant and have been recommending to everyone I know ever since. Even though it's obvious what the ending is going to be that doesn't matter because it adds a scary sense of inevitability - you just know she's fucked. The bit when she's driving through the desert at night and a face appears at the side window had particular resonance for me because if I drive alone at night I always start worrying about there being somebody hiding in the back seat or whatever. A ghostly face keeping pace with the car would be something else though...

I just saw Carnival of Souls as well for the first time ever a few weeks ago and entirely agree. The sense of DREAD that overhangs everything makes for a hugely tense viewing experience, and the micro-budget doesn't get in the way at all...in fact the ramshackle nature of the film almost contributes to it. Fantastic movie - I was very worried that it would be disappointing given how much it's been built up but, if anything, it exceeded expectations.

That ghostly face scene was terrifying, and the organ freakout is one of the creepiest things I've seen in a while.

 

[Mr. Tea]

The bit when she's driving through the desert at night and a face appears at the side window had particular resonance for me because if I drive alone at night I always start worrying about there being somebody hiding in the back seat or whatever.

Just as well you don't have a car, eh? Though if you or I or most Londoners are travelling late at night it's probably by bus, and something like that is actually not unlikely to happen on a London night bus.

 

[IdleRich]

"I was very worried that it would be disappointing given how much it's been built up but, if anything, it exceeded expectations."

Well, I was lucky on that score because I'd never heard of it. I just saw it in the video library and thought it looked interesting.

"That ghostly face scene was terrifying, and the organ freakout is one of the creepiest things I've seen in a while."

Yeah, great scene - the music was brilliant all the way through.
Did you see that according to the extras eight minutes of footage relating to the creatures emerging out of the desert was lost in processing? Shame because it sounded like a powerful scene.

 

[zhao]

Eternal Sunshine was a heartbreaking work of staggering genius. Or something.

i walked out of the theater and demanded my money back after 30 minutes and they would not give me a refund

i walked out of Science of Sleep after only 15 minutes and managed to get my 12USD back

 

[zhao]

Chris Marker: San Soleil,
Andre Tarkovsky: Stalker,
Carl Dreyer: The Passion of Joan of Arc,
Apichatpong Weerasethakul: Sud Pralad (Tropical Malady),
Werner Herzog: Stroszek,
Abbas Kiarostami: Ten,
Hayao Miyazaki: Princess Mononoke,
Jan Kounen: Dobermann,
Takashi Miike: Chûgoku no chôjin (The Bird People of China),
Gillo Pontecorvo: La Battaglia di Algeri (The Battle of Algiers),
Mikhail Kalatozov: Soy Cuba (I Am Cuba),
Miranda July: Me and You and Everyone We Know.
Wong Kar Wei: In the Mood for Love,
Mike Judge: Office Space,
David Lynch: Mulholland Drive,
Marc Caro / Jean-Pierre Jeunet: Cité des enfants perdus, La (The CIty of Lost Children),

 

[bruno]

i walked out of the theater and demanded my money back after 30 minutes

i also lasted about thirty minutes, thankfully not in the theatre. the only film i have walked out on has been life is beautiful, it was torture. jim carrey should stick to ace ventura, things like that. ace ventura pet detective, now that's a good film.

 

[zhao]

i also lasted about thirty minutes, thankfully not in the theatre. the only film i have walked out on has been life is beautiful, it was torture.

me too! i don't know why anyone in their right mind would want to watch these pathetic sick fucks. it's just disgusting. why not just go into a mental institution and watch people mutilate themselves.

as for Eternal Bullshit of a Stupid Mind and the Science of Tackiness... they're so "cutting edge"! "ground breaking"! "experimental!" "magical!" "surreal!" BARF

people who say this are confusing garish MTV special effects for "visual innovation"; solipsistic vapid self absorption (because there is nothing else) for "depth of feeling"; and cheap tricks which insult my intelligence and offend my aesthetic sensibility for real film magic.

and that's what this is about, and the reason I hate these films: they substitute cutesy flashy gimmicks for real cinematic experience, and substitute wince-worthy coffee-shop cliches for poetry, and give us cheap and tacky one-liner Hall-Mark type "deep thoughts" instead of profundity.

perfect for a generation which does not know real cinema: films of such resonance and enigma that you find yourself thinking about them lying awake at night a decade later... films whose images haunt you in your most private moments of clarity, and reveal layers of meaning with each passing season. films made with elegance and grace and a supreme economy which continues to give with each viewing -- the more you think about them, the more they are rewarding.

stick to music videos where these stupid little tricks actually work as a passing distraction would be my suggestion. EDIT: vapid trendy music video extended to 1.5 hours = ANNOYING ATTENTION DEFICIT DISORDER GARBAGE.

 

[DannyL]

I think you're being a little harsh on Eternal Sunshine. Visual trickery over depth is a good point - but i think the film has some very interesting things to say about relationships. Your post actually makes me want to watch it again so I can argue with you !

 

[DannyL]

However, having said that - why shouldn't films use "garish MTV speical effects"? Do films then have to be made with "economy"? Surely visual spectacle is part of the "magic of cinema"? I like OTT mise-en-scene - this is one of the things I love about Terry Gillingham's films for instance.

 

[DannyL]

Re. the film and relationships. I found very touching, and deep in a lot of ways, on first watch - the way in which the protagonists *choose* to take the chance on re-running their relationship - despite/even because of - knowing that it's going to go wrong. There's a lot more to it than this as well, but I can't remember the subtleties. Fuck it, it's a great film

I'm going to rewatch this weekend and then i'll get back to you with more.

 

[Grievous Angel]

Do you mean Terry Gilliam?

paul ye ex-pedant.

 

[DannyL]

No, I mean the other Terry - that obscure guy you've not heard of BECAUSE YOU KNOW NOTHING

 

[DannyL]

*I don't really*

 

[zhao]

the film has some very interesting things to say about relationships.

like what? you shouldn't go out with stupid annoying 90s grunge chicks with red hair? LOL.

pathetic self pity interspersed with cutesy childhood scenes DOES NOT EQUAL "a meditation on memory and loss"

obnoxious A.D.D. jump-cut style DOES NOT EQUAL "an evocation of the fragmentary and ephemeral nature of perception and love"

why shouldn't films use "garish MTV speical effects"?

I'm not saying that these things should never be employed, but for the most part vapid trendy music video extended to 1.5 hours = ANNOYING ATTENTION DEFICIT DISORDER GARBAGE.

Do films then have to be made with "economy"?

good art is ALWAYS made with an elegant economy. in my book at least.

Surely visual spectacle is part of the "magic of cinema"? I like OTT mise-en-scene - this is one of the things I love about Terry Gillingham's films for instance.

of course. notice i rated DOBERMAN which is shot like a commercial for a sports car in my top 10. but a part of what is annoying about these Gondry flicks is the huge difference between what they are -- cheap sentimentality and un-profound emptiness dressed up in trendy po-mo fashion victim clutter -- VS. what they are touted to be (all those bullshit descriptors i listed in the beginning)

 

[DannyL]

like what? you shouldn't go out with stupid annoying 90s grunge chicks with red hair? LOL

I think there's a lot more to it than that.

Like I said, i've only seen it the once, so I can't recall all of what I felt/saw at the time. It did seem to be saying somthing resonant for me about the cyclical nature of the way we involve ourselves with people, despite or even because of our past histories. the film seems to straddle the divide and doesn't present this as being an optimistic or disastrous state of affairs. This is one of the reasons I liked it so much - this lack of judgement, managing to hold two possibilities open...

As evidence for the defence, I'll marshall this thread from another board I frequent from a few years ago - this page 2 http://www.barbelith.com/topic/15834/from/35

Everyone's being complimentary about it so that may make you want to pull your eyes out but note that pretty much no one is talking about the film as spectacle - no one was sucked in by Gondry's evil MTV tricks - most people wanted to discuss and tease out the exact nature of the relationship between the two main characters.

 

[DannyL]

... and as I said the way that this isn't fixed or closed is one of the film's strengths. Very different from most mainstream cinematic narratives.

BTW - bearing in mind you walked out of the cinema - have you seen it all the way through ever?

 

[zhao]

... and as I said the way that this isn't fixed or closed is one of the film's strengths. Very different from most mainstream cinematic narratives.

BTW - bearing in mind you walked out of the cinema - have you seen it all the way through ever?

actually yes unfortunately... at a friend's place... couldn't be avoided really.

but i admit to a bit of exaggeration on this subject. that the reason for that is the praise leveled at it by all these hipsters everywhere...

i mean i believe in real film magic. films that change your life. or make you see the world in a new light. and this shit has nothing to do with that.

and there is nothing wrong with sentimental or "cheap tricks" per se either... for instance i liked Amelie... may be hard to reconcile with my hatred of these, but i dunno, it just worked well, and was good for what it is -- instead of pretending to be all these things that it isn't -- and even more annoying successfully pulling one over everyone.

 

[IdleRich]

I'm kinda with Zhao on this I think. I mean, maybe it's not quite as bad as he says but it's definitely one of those films that thinks it's really clever when it's not. The idea is not bad but I thought it was executed with too much cheap sentiment and also it was very predictable. On top of that, the premise was unbelievable I think - not necessarily disastrous in itself but I thought that combined with the smugness it just served to emphasise the huge gap between what the film thought it was and what it actually achieved. Maybe I'm more inclined to pick the film up for its deficiencies due to the critical (and fan) reception it got though, I dunno.
DannyL - what's your name on Barbelith?

 

[DannyL]

I think this is one of the things Dissensus and forums generally are good for - reactng to hype, overselling and fashionability.

I don't think every film has to be life changing - sometimes entertainment is enough, but rergardless I still think ESOTSM is a level up from just entertainment as I said. I can see why it gets on your tits though.

(Ironically enough I'm going through a breakup at the moment - I don't really wish someone could burn out my emotions and memories with a brain laser but at moments it doesn't seem like a bad idea).