HEGEL

[Benny Bunter]

What do you think @vershy versh ? Are you Team Hegel or Team Marx?

 

[Benny Bunter]

What experience and history teaches us is that people and governments have never learned anything from history, or acted on principles deduced from it.

Georg Wilhelm Friedrich Hegel

• Like
• likes: 165

I like this quote and it seems true.

 

[version]

What do you think @vershy versh ? Are you Team Hegel or Team Marx?

Marx's materialism seems more sensible to me, less 'mystical', as he says, but you don't have to pick one or the other. This is part of Deleuze's thing. He rejects Hegel and dialectics.

 

[Benny Bunter]

Georg Wilhelm Friedrich Hegel

• Like
• likes: 165

I like this quote and it seems true.

So are we to take from this that Marx thinks the exact opposite, that people and governments do learn from history and act upon principles deduced from it?

And how can history have 'principles'?

 

[version]

So are we to take from this that Marx thinks the exact opposite, that people and governments do learn from history and act upon principles deduced from it?

I wouldn't read every line of Hegel with the assumption Marx says the opposite. He just inverts the dialectic.

 

[luka]

i think history for hegel has principles in that it is a becoming consciousness, gaining self awareness of itself
like stan talks about things becoming more complex and self-organised over time, ameoba to human

 

[dilbert1]

@Benny Bunter read the first half with us

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www.marxists.org

 

[version]

Marx seems a lot more boring than hegel to me instinctively.

He's got some great lines.

All fixed, fast frozen relations, with their train of ancient and venerable prejudices and opinions, are swept away, all new-formed ones become antiquated before they can ossify. All that is solid melts into air, all that is holy is profaned...​

 

[Benny Bunter]

He's got some great lines.

All fixed, fast frozen relations, with their train of ancient and venerable prejudices and opinions, are swept away, all new-formed ones become antiquated before they can ossify. All that is solid melts into air, all that is holy is profaned...​

Yeah that's a good one. Reminds me of Shakespeare.

 

[version]

I think even Marx has a flavour of mysticism to him, although Third would probably tear my head off saying Marxism's a science. That thing he gets from Hegel of everything inexorably moving towards a particular form doesn't feel very scientific to me. It feels like prophecy.

 

[Benny Bunter]

@Benny Bunter read the first half with us

Maybe I will, next week though.

 

[luka]

I think even Marx has a flavour of mysticism to him, although Third would probably tear my head off saying Marxism's a science. That thing he gets from Hegel of everything inexorably moving towards a particular form doesn't feel very scientific to me. It feels like prophecy.

very mystical. its kinda cool. maybe one day i will read it.

 

[dilbert1]

All great things take time. Everyone could do ten pages a day. What’s the rush

 

[version]

Yeah that's a good one. Reminds me of Shakespeare.

He probably did borrow it from The Tempest. He loved Shakespeare.

Our revels now are ended. These our actors,
As I foretold you, were all spirits and
Are melted into air, into thin air:
And, like the baseless fabric of this vision,
The cloud-capp'd towers, the gorgeous palaces,
The solemn temples, the great globe itself,
Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve
And, like this insubstantial pageant faded,
Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff
As dreams are made on, and our little life
Is rounded with a sleep.

 

[luka]

Maybe I will, next week though.

humiliate version the coward by reading it.

All great things take time. Everyone could do ten pages a day. What’s the rush

to be the winner.

 

[luka]

He probably did borrow it from The Tempest. He loved Shakespeare.

thats another things thats cool about him.. he'd read everything. like prynne. i love people who can read and assimilate everything. it would be the superpower i would choose i think.

 

[luka]

i wish i could sing though. and id choose to be able to speak french better than woops for how much it would annoy him.

 

[luka]

the problem with reading is it means youre sitting on your arse all on your tod a lot

 

[version]

the problem with reading is it means youre sitting on your arse all on your tod a lot

The horror!

 

[luka]

but as you get older it becomes more feasible. you cant catch up to the prynnes whove been doing it all their lives though, and getting paid to do it too.