version

Well-known member
Really one of the most tedious things about leftist cultures. Endless whacky imagination about idealistic systems that are never successfully put into practice. Endless tiring criticism of actual working systems.

It can be quite draining, yeah. I just try to read the stuff I reckon I'll find interesting. I think if you were to spend your life reading nowt but Adorno and similar figures then you could become a bit of a husk.
 

version

Well-known member
And yet no intellectuals or artists advocate it because it's so untouchably lowbrow a take. Insight, or conformity?

There've been plenty of artists and intellectuals who weren't communists, or even on the left at all.
 

luka

Well-known member
Lots of them have done a more advanced version of it. Ccru for instance. And they got it partly from deleuze and guattari
 

sus

Moderator
There've been plenty of artists and intellectuals who weren't communists, or even on the left at all.
It's not really about the left is it, I mean the right is really the party of "things were better in the past." My point is it's so ubiquitous both parties basically agree
 

version

Well-known member
It's not really about the left is it, I mean the right is really the party of "things were better in the past." My point is it's so ubiquitous both parties basically agree

Maybe human beings are instinctively conservative. It's a good defense mechanism.
 
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sufi

lala
a few times i have found myself mentally reaching for the search box in books, once or twice my mouse finger has even twitched
PSYCHOPATHOLOGY OF DIGITAL LIFE, 1.—F.: “More and more often, I feel as though I’ve lost touch with
the objects of physical space. All around me, physical space is becoming a limbo, a huge attic in which
objects randomly accumulate behind a closed door no one dares to open, terrified of the chaos that
awaits on the other side. Before, I used to know in the blink of an eye where to find any one of my
innumerable books; now it’s much more difficult, just as my relation to all things I’m not connected to
on the internet has become more difficult. On Google, I can’t ask where I put my keys; I can’t act upon
them. I can’t summon my books to my side. More and more actions are accomplished entirely on the
internet; those that still require physical action have become strange and nearly impossible. If someone
asks me to fill out forms and send them by mail, I become disoriented. It isn’t familiar to me anymore.
The thought of having to look for a paper I’m supposed to have in my possession causes me great
anxiety. Everything that isn’t digital suddenly seems fragile, lost, not to be grasped in any way, like
trying to find a needle in a haystack. And when I have to sift through papers, either those that I’ve had
for a long while or those that still arrive in too great a number, I tell myself with horror that all these
insignificant documents that I’m about to throw away—cinema tickets, tourism brochures, old bank
statements that I thought would one day compose a remarkably precise archive of my comings and
goings, etc.—might in time have acquired considerable value, as they became traces, testimonies, spurs
to recollection, and even, in a slightly more distant future, collectibles, historical documents, materials
for a work of art. In digital extension—I can’t help calling it that—at least we can keep everything
without having to choose.”
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
at this thing in woolwich the whole place was awash with skunk smoke and i thought about how great it would be to lock you in a floatation tank there and play you nothing but 140 bpm hard techno for 12 months non-stop no let up no breakdowns no cartoon physics gabba absurdity no nothing. just looping millsian hard techno. then you will begin to hate drugs.
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
It's my bravest position, the greatest testament to my independence of mind.

If the limit of your imagination is arcade fire then no thanks I'll rather have sabrina carpenter splice sample pack loops.

Stop preparing the confession! it's so undignified!
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
For instance, Patty's posted like three times in the last twenty-four hours some disclaimer like, "Being shiny isn't what it used to be" (because Elon Musk and other technocrats are wealthy) or "Nobody takes artistic risks anymore" (like Dylan did).

Now, I've been having a nice time chatting with Patty today and I certainly don't want to upset that with dissensus but, why do we seem to instinctually believe this? Shouldn't we be a little suspicious? Or at least openminded about how the past was, given we weren't around to experience it? Given that it comes to us from... Movies? Nostalgic Boomers? Cherrypicked (self-)mythologizing from the artists and writers of the past?

I told you time and time again. I have a proletarian hatred of culture and science. culture and science are conservative. Patty just doesn't believe in revolutionary terror, because he is a backpacking hippie. Even 60s culture was conservative and counter-revolutionary. There was no better days. It was all always fucking shit!

Scientific discoveries solve problems, yes. Artistic collaboration enriches the achievements of the species, yes. Art and culture as alienated spheres don't. bourgeois science doesn't. your thinking is too schematic, you and ghost want to invent a new priesthood and succumb to the exact same conservatism. It's honestly very disheartening conversing with you because you never ever make that next step. You have much better insights than most on this forum but then you want to be happy go lucky. Think more like a moody turk! throw corroding amulets into a sealed tomb!

 

william_kent

Well-known member
at this thing in woolwich the whole place was awash with skunk smoke and i thought about how great it would be to lock you in a floatation tank there and play you nothing but 140 bpm hard techno for 12 months non-stop no let up no breakdowns no cartoon physics gabba absurdity no nothing. just looping millsian hard techno. then you will begin to hate drugs.

I used to buy records off Martin the OG Eastern Bloc record shop guy from 808 State, he ducked out early and wasted his top ten hit money on a flotation tank centre

I wonder what he is doing now?
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
Simply put, no. There is that factor, but one of the horses I keep beating over and over on here and elsewhere is that it's all been done. The constellation required for another explosion like we had from the 50s to the 90s would require a stream of new technologies that allow for exploration into new sounds to be coming out - in combination with a generation of kids full of energy and subversive zest, champing at the bit to get their hands on said tech and having some sort of ethos to communicate through it. But I don't see that type of energy in young people anymore. I see boredom, listlessness, too cool for school, folded arms, flicking an cynical 'what?' at the camera. Thinking theyre the shit but palpably conservative. Hollowed out. Scared to step outside of the consensus. Maybe unaware that that's even an option. All thanks to the homogenization of globalized culture and the dulling effects of being raised by and living through the screens. There just isn't the same spark as there was when I was that age, and that spark is the key to it all. It's what lights the fires. Don't get me wrong, not everyone had that even back then, and only a small few managed to make something good out of it at all, but where are those equivalent few now? I'm waiting to hear from them

You anthropomorphize technology to a delitirious degree. In reality the vocabulary of electronic music haven't been explored to even a third of its potential. it is stigmatised by the limit set by bourgeois society. Art as private consumption.

The concrete guys like Bayle understood this, but in socialism cinemas for the ears will be as readily available as cinemas for the eyes. Electroacoustic theatres for everyone.

Kids from my limited experience seem to understand things through data. They learn how to live through data. They analyse and calculate how to have their first kiss by watching a YouTube tutorial. They learn how to talk to their crush via chatGPT. It's a world architected by nerds who never had a chance. Never loved or were loved in return. Never got their hands dirty. No wonder they're all bored. That shit kills creativity. To have a generation of creatives they need to be surrounded by and immersed in a creative world. People need something to build off of. But the current ground has been overfarmed. I get that some people are doing some shit on tiktok but is any of it really thought provoking ala jenks' post? Or some Blake or Shakespeare?

Jenks supports Spurs, there's no reason to take anything he says seriously on this topic, they will probably make 20 DVDs if they win the EL. Magical thinking if ever there was one.

You manage to even excel that by pretending algorithms are this new invention when in reality all that has changed is the speed at which they are computed.

Yes but we don't even have an equivalent to that now. There's nothing happening of that nature in art. Tiktok? Everyone caring as much about seeming TV ready with perfect skincare and ring lights n shit than talking about revolution? Where's the fucking grime? The doomscroll gen has been fully subsumed, while playing acting and spouting words about shit they've never lived. Fated to dwell within the guidelines which act like a maze with no exit. Whole world is contrived now man. As I said, it's gonna take some fucking freaks who don't give a shit about anything to break us out, if it ever happens NYC in the late 70s style, smash smash smash

As soon as art can talk about being revolutionary then that is exactly when revolution is off the table. Real revolution is basically civil war. 70s nyc was an antisocial cocaine dump and disco was built off the back of the FBI defanging black struggle by flooding neighbourhoods with crack and heroin. I love disco as craft but let us be absolutely fucking real here! It was hedonistic escape! (even if that escape was consummate due to the high levels of musicianship...)

You seem to think that as soon as you fall in love with something, it can't really be bad or even result from circumstances that were bad, which is how Gus can set up his silly straw men,. Learn to make your funkiness more mathematic!

No one will remember Arcade Fire in 10 years. Radiohead are fronted by a poseur Zionist blowhard who loves the sound of his own warbling and tries to have his revolutionary cake and eat it. Singing the effete plights of the middle classes and purposely plucking at your heartstrings like a fucking vulture. Meanwhile, to contradict myself, outside of our western bubble, there's music going on. Just check @The King of Pussy Gettin's latest mix. Latin America is on fire at the moment. Africa etc..

This I agree with. But that exactly supports my point. It's not the tech, it's not even data, people in Latin America and even in Africa are subject to the same constraints. It's about how far capitalist culture can go, which is why it must be despised.

So not even Joni or Bob? 🧐

Joni has one great album and one banging hit song, but otherwise... And the good album is not the Blue album. It's song to a seagul.
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
Just been reading about the recent spike in audiobook usage in the last few years. I'm guessing it's kind of connected to how easy it is to listen to books while on the move, in the gym, in the car etc. I must admit that since lockdown i have become a convert and regularly listen to stuff while on the turbo trainer (however, i always have a physical copy of the book too as i like to go back and loo over certain passages)
I'm just wondering do people perceive them as reading or something else, i see there's serious disagreement online? And if you do listen to audiobooks do you play them at normal speed or x1.3 or something, and does that matter? Finally, any recommendations? I have listened to quite a few and it's really interesting the way that some writers really cannot read their own work and really should just pay an actor to do it properly.

no, I use a speech synth.
 

william_kent

Well-known member
Joni has one great album and one banging hit song, but otherwise... And the good album is not the Blue album. It's song to a seagul.

I'm normally onboard with your posts but I have to take exception here - when did Joni have one good tune? or album?

seriously, confused
 
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