can I get ill from eating too much bacon?

[Precious Cuts]

so your logic is as follows: because Foucault was an amazing writer, historian, and philosopher, so he must be absolutely spot-on when it comes to health and nutrition, and we should model our diet after his eating habits?

My logic was simply that Foucault a) knows how to enjoy fine food, b) obviously isn't brainwashed and c) still loves diner food. Therefore, you can enjoy diner food without being a victim of false consciousness. Whether or not it is healthy to do so is besides the point.

thanks for the reply. lots of good points.

I actually said "cooked animal proteine", and not just "animal protein". cooked meat drastically increases carcenogen levels, and toxifies the body more than anything else -- and these toxins does not leave the body for a long time, and causes many problems.

I suppose the jokes about eating raw meat will follow --but what you may not know is that much like raw fish is professionally prepared, raw meat can as well. and it is the best source of protein. it is not common but many traditional cultures have raw beef and other meat dishes -- Armenian, Vietnamese, etc, etc.

but you are right that vegetarianism is not the catch all solution, (but in my estimation is predominantly, overwhelmingly beneficial).

and you are right about over consumption of carbohydrates -- and that pre-agricultural diet is much more healthy -- all major diseases such as cancer did not exist before we started farming -- but there are different view points as to what "caveman" diet consisted of exactly -- what I know and have read, may be contrary to some historians and doctors in mainstream medicine, leads me to believe that it was thousands of kinds of raw plants, and little meat -- and very little cooked meat.

my bad I didn't notice the cooked qualification. I've had some really good lebanese raw kibbeh (ground lamb & beef w/ pine nuts & olive oil) before. It feels pretty good after eating. Kind of like sushi. I don't think I could eat raw meat all the time though.

 

[zhao]

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41208000/jpg/_41208332_glow203.jpg

 

[martin]

I'm eating 7-8 rashers a day, every day, at the moment.

Yes, you can get cancer. Stop doing it.

To think Conflict were right about this all along....

 

[noel emits]

Ned's last post on this site was in mid August.

 

[martin]

Ned's last post on this site was in mid August.

Did you actually click on his profile and look that up, or were you there when he had to flee the country over the whole Maddie thing?

 

[noel emits]

I clicked on his profile. Had no idea about the other thing. Don't do anything rash Ned.

I suppose the pigs get you one way or another.

 

[nomadologist]

umm it won't piss me off, but you're wrong, about protein anyway. There is nothing wrong with animal proteins in and of themselves. People should eat lots of fish. You simply can't have too much protein because whatever you don't use comes out the other end.

The agrarian lifestyle is so bad for humans. So so bad.

Poor Cam!! How can someone so beautiful on the outside be on so much pain on the inside? Weed and loperamide really are the only things that will help. IBS and IBD are rampant in America, because of all the refined carb eating.

 

[nomadologist]

so your logic is as follows: because Foucault was an amazing writer, historian, and philosopher, so he must be absolutely spot-on when it comes to health and nutrition, and we should model our diet after his eating habits?



thanks for the reply. lots of good points.

I actually said "cooked animal proteine", and not just "animal protein". cooked meat drastically increases carcenogen levels, and toxifies the body more than anything else -- and these toxins does not leave the body for a long time, and causes many problems.

I suppose the jokes about eating raw meat will follow --but what you may not know is that much like raw fish is professionally prepared, raw meat can as well. and it is the best source of protein. it is not common but many traditional cultures have raw beef and other meat dishes -- Armenian, Vietnamese, etc, etc.

but you are right that vegetarianism is not the catch all solution, (but in my estimation is predominantly, overwhelmingly beneficial).

and you are right about over consumption of carbohydrates -- and that pre-agricultural diet is much more healthy -- all major diseases such as cancer did not exist before we started farming -- but there are different view points as to what "caveman" diet consisted of exactly -- what I know and have read, may be contrary to some historians and doctors in mainstream medicine, leads me to believe that it was thousands of kinds of raw plants, and little meat -- and very little cooked meat.

No, Zhao, I think you may be getting some info from sources that have an "agenda" to push. Humans hunted for animals throughout history until the agrarian age. We have canine teeth and appendices. These are for chewing and digesting meat.

Ever seen Anthony Bourdain's show where he goes to Africa? They eat the WHOLE pig over there, cheeks, tongue, eyes, and all. Apparently it's delicious.

 

[nomadologist]

I'm sure this will piss a great number of people off -- you "underground music" types can be just as closed-minded as the red-necks: "IT'S MY GOD GIVEN RIGHT TO HAVE MY MOTHER-FUCKIN STEAKS EVERY NIGHT DAMMIT! AND AIN'T NO NEW AGE HIPPIE FREAK GONNA TELL ME OTHERWISE!"

Zhao, I hate to say this, but you clearly have not studied anatomy and physiology, biochemistry, biology, anthropology, or any number of disciplines that fully debunk what you are saying about meat. No offense. But you're being really weirdly stubborn and calling people "rednecks" for understanding the Krebs cycle is pretty ridic.

 

[noel emits]

We have canine teeth and appendices. These are for chewing and digesting meat.

Four canines out of a total of around 32 teeth. They're more for tearing, not chewing and digesting.

I don't think we need to eat meet at all but to be fair it's the quantity that's out of order. Large scale meet production is going a long way to destroy rainforests in Brazil and elsewhere and that's really not good for anyone's health. How can that be justified?

Also what do you thing the Appendix is for exactly? Isn't it generally reckoned to be a vestigial organ?

 

[nomadologist]

Four canines out of a total of around 32 teeth. They're more for tearing, not chewing and digesting.

I don't think we need to eat meet at all but to be fair it's the quantity that's out of order. Large scale meet production is going a long way to destroy rainforests in Brazil and elsewhere and that's really not good for anyone's health. How can that be justified?

Also what do you thing the Appendix is for exactly? Isn't it generally reckoned to be a vestigial organ?

Well, to qualify what I've said, I would never deny that too much red meat (with too much fat content) does eventually cause atherosclerosis and other CV events if you don't exercise properly and often. Lean, white proteins are best, but there are amino acids and lipids in red meat that our entire bodies/brains evolved around eating. Even simple carbohydrates require breaking down in the liver into proteins and fats. This is extremely hard on your system. This is why people with hepatitis are not supposed to eat sugars and carbs.

The appendix is vestigial NOW, because we stopped eating a diet that consisted (pre-agrarian times) of fresh killed meat often rotten after days of lack of refrigeration.

Meat production, like various forms of production (including plant to chemical, veggie pattie, feed, many of our basic needs, etc.), are, indeed, bad for the planet. This is part of a much larger issue that needs to be addressed on largely economic and not dietary levels.

 

[nomadologist]

Also, "rednecks" are not necessarily "close-minded" as much as they are severely lacking in resources that would allow them to get sufficient education.

 

[nomadologist]

in the short term the carcenogens created by your stomach's inability to deal with all that cooked animal protean will give you lower energy levels, decreased ability to focus and concentrate, and probably a few unwanted pounds added to your physique.

in the long term you are looking at high blood pressure, clogged veins, heart problems, or, even if pork tends to stay and rot in your lower intestines slightly less than beef (years and years), there is always the increasingly, wildly, popular choice: prostate/colon cancer.

sorry to break it to ya. ain't nothin' you put in your body you don't pay for down the road. and the price just may be cancer of the butt.

what are you talking about, carcinogens from meat metabolism? this is simply not true. protein metabolism does NOT "create" carcinogens. there are carcinogens (in the form of radiation and such) in everything, even things that grow in the ground! they are everywhere in our environment (so are free radicals).

prostate cancer has NOTHING to do with meat consumption, either.

 

[nomadologist]

meat does not "rot" in your intestines, the acid in your stomach very neatly and easily begins to digest the protein BEFORE it even gets to the liver. it is MUCH EASIER on your organs than carbohydrates for this reason. it is much more efficiently metabolised.

 

[nomadologist]

you can also get cardiovascular disease if you eat a lot of red meat even if you live an otherwise healthy lifestyle. in fact i'd go as far to say that large amounts of red meat does not equal a healthy lifestyle full stop. theres nothing wrong with it in moderation though.

personally i don't feel very good if i eat red meat dishes for a couple of days running.

you can also get cardiovascular disease from stressing out too much and eating too much cheese and drinking too much alcohol.

if red meat is making you feel bad, it may be because you eat too many carbs. of course, some people's systems respond differently to different nutrients, but i wouldn't be surprised if you had insulin problems.

 

[nomadologist]

Alright then, got any evidence?

There's no consensus on exactly why red meat is linked with increased bowel cancer - one theory is that it's because of the production of heterocyclic amines, carcinogens that are produced in cooking. However, cooking white meat also produces these carcinogens, but white meat does not show a link with bowel cancer.

More generally, I think the "dangers" of red meat for health are masked by the presence of other negative factors - trans fatty acids, processed vegetable oils, salt and sugar. All of which are present in processed foods, and it's difficult to find large numbers of people who eat a lot of red meat but not processed meat

Precisely. Correlation does not prove causation--if they've been able to isolate red meat as a possible cause of colon/bowel cancer (IF they have, I have never read this in a medical journal but I will look it up), I am absolutely sure that the controls on the experiments weren't tight enough. Unless they fed the people diets of 100% whole, organic, unrefined, fiber filled diets with an excess of red meat, there is no way to say definitively that OTHER contributing factors are involved in the rise of colon/bowel cancer.

 

[nomadologist]

is it me or is this article entirely about scientists being much more certain now than ever before about the link between red-meat and cancer?

It's about PROCESSED red meat. I would love to see the numbers for this. Probably a lot lower than the cancer incidence from, say, the pill.

 

[nomadologist]

maybe my description is exaggerated, but I would say most people do function like this. raised with wrong eating habits, constantly bombarded by advertising from an early age, we are conditioned to eat in an unhealthy way, mistaking it for pleasure. most people everywhere are addicted to very, very unhealthy diets -- obscene over-consumption of cooked animal protein for one thing -- and it causes them no small amount of suffering.

another sign of pervasive unhealthy diet -- just look at the rate of childhood obesity - also rising at an alarming rate.

The rise in obesity is linked to a sharp increase of daily calorie intake, especially from processed and refined CARBOHYDRATES.

 

[bruno]

Did you actually click on his profile and look that up, or were you there when he had to flee the country over the whole Maddie thing?

haha

 

[zhao]

i'll give you that the fact that meat or red meat is processed, trans-fatty acidic, etc., and i'll add to that cooked, account for probably the majority or all of the harms with eating meat. (and the excessive amount with which we do it)

i've always said that an organic raw steak every 2 weeks is the healthiest thing for a human body.

raw goat's blood, that the tribe in africa survives on, is like the elixir of the gods -- that's pretty much all they intake, and they are some of the healthiest people on earth. (they make a tiny incision behind the hoof, and take amounts of blood not close to affecting the the goat -- in exchange for protection and care, presumably)