Skream

[elgato]

But elgato - are you seriously asking if 2D is a masterpiece? Get a grip!!!!!! It's not a masterpiece - it's a tinkly little tune that goes blip blip blop and I'm sure Skream would be the first to say so.

i dont really know what i think, but its irrelevent to what i was saying anyway... i was questioning the concepts which underlie our ideas of value in music (or art), with 'masterpiece' or 'genius' just representing the extremes of sliding scales of artistic value, and 2D and skream providing examples.

philosophically speaking i think 2D is a 'great work of art' (looking at it again, 'masterpiece' implies something too tied to the artist's 'mastery' to serve my purpose) if people think it is

but my opinion is what makes it interesting for me, because my instinct wants to say that (for example) Clipz hasnt produced a great work of art, but my logic tells me otherwise

my pondering may seem a little basic to anyone with a knowledge of theory or philosophy of art, if so apologies

 

[UFO over easy]

Clipz actually made some pretty heavy bristol-ish stuff early in his career

 

[hopper]

In fairness to boomkat, I was jus checkin through the baked goods back catalogue and all the dubstep stuff put out through there is solid, and that review was made a back in january or something... With boomkat reviews its generally clear whether they love it or simply goin through the motions as well, and i've seen some pretty funny ones where they've been really critical, but that doesn't help them sell records I guess..

 

[Sick Boy]

I am a big advocate of the techno influence on dubstep. It's producing a lot of amazing tracks right now, but in my opinion, 2D isn't one of them.

2D sounds like Skream's attempt at a style that other people are doing much better. When it comes down to it, it sounds like a fruity loops demo. His remixes of Mark Ashken were lightyears better.

 

[UFO over easy]

This tune here is one of the best tunes I've heard in dubstep, by anyone. Skream's one of those guys where the stuff I dislike, I really dislike, and the stuff I like, I love. I like that though, keeps me on my toes.. and I understand why people like the stuff I don't

check it out - http://senduit.com/bc9d28

I think he says it's called Signus? The second drop is pure screwface stuff, but not even because of the weight or anything... it's just deliciously funky and offkey.

 

[noel emits]

i dont really know what i think, but its irrelevent to what i was saying anyway... i was questioning the concepts which underlie our ideas of value in music (or art), with 'masterpiece' or 'genius' just representing the extremes of sliding scales of artistic value, and 2D and skream providing examples.

Yeah sorry, I didn't mean to come across as so outraged. I knew what you were getting at really - I suppose I just don't want to see that word used too casually.

 

[noel emits]

This tune here is one of the best tunes I've heard in dubstep, by anyone. Skream's one of those guys where the stuff I dislike, I really dislike, and the stuff I like, I love. I like that though, keeps me on my toes.. and I understand why people like the stuff I don't

check it out - http://senduit.com/bc9d28

I think he says it's called Signus? The second drop is pure screwface stuff, but not even because of the weight or anything... it's just deliciously funky and offkey.

'kinell that's good in't it? Yowsers. Dubstep business right 'ere

 

[elgato]

Yeah sorry, I didn't mean to come across as so outraged. I knew what you were getting at really - I suppose I just don't want to see that word used too casually.

no problem! it was clearly a very playful outrage

but i guess my questions would challenge how seriously we should take words like masterpiece... if we accept subjectivity of value in art, which many of us do (i guess), and reject complexity or strictly technical achievement as necessary to great art (which i think many of us do), then what does masterpiece even mean anymore? and is it appropriate in a cohesive logic that adheres to the above? is it not just an archaic relic of a view of art which has been rejected by many of us?

or am i being too presumptuous about what other people believe?

 

[elgato]

check it out - http://senduit.com/bc9d28

so deep!

love that new approach to sub he's been using

i also love how commonplace completely next 2nd drops are in dubstep

 

[UFO over easy]

I think what's interesting is questioning why people intuitively do seem to cling to ideas like artistic objectivity despite the fact that all logic seems to dictate that it's nonsense.. if I'm right in thinking most people probably do.

 

[hopper]

I quite like what Ben said about the bits he really likes by skream he loves and the ones he doesn't he really dislikes... I personally don't get that SO much, but find it weird that something can be like that cos you don't quite know how to categorise him as a result cos you can't call him a genius for it as you think he's done so much crap, or if Ben's saying the stuff he hates is genius but he hates it then I guess you can call him a genius... If that makes sense, anyway the tune Ben uploaded is sick! Best I've heard from skream in a long time. I was listening to blipstream yesterday for the first time in a while and it was fookin amazing, I love all the ambient melodies and that ridiculous bassline.

 

[noel emits]

Two hours on Wonderful Radio 1's Essential Mix tonight.

That's got to be the biggest exposure a dubstep-only show of any length has had? And he's playing pretty much just his own stuff so far.

 

[noel emits]

Funny how it sounds so Radio 1 and slick, must be the BBC's magic compressor or something. Coming across as very pop and accessible. I can see lots of electro-house (or whatever) heads having no problem with this at all.

Actually some of this stuff is basically techno/trance/electro with more emphasis on the 3rd beat, or the subliminal skank That's no bad thing. Still sounding fresh.

 

[evergreen]

link!

i doubt the use of the preset in 2D would matter as much if it were anything other than a melodic element. people are really touchy about melody. but it seems like the actual melody in 2D is less important to the track's impact than the way the preset sample carves out a new rhythmic space (and texture) in between the halfstep snares. this is also clearer in the context of the Essential Mix, where you can see Skream doing this with virtually every track, in various ways.

 

[Blackdown]

to be fair, "request line" also "carved out a new rhythmic space" too, using melody to imply rhythm - something grime (which request line aped) did and does well.

 

[borderpolice]

to be fair, "request line" also "carved out a new rhythmic space" too, using melody to imply rhythm - something grime (which request line aped) did and does well.

Sorry to be pedantic, but any melody implies/has rhythm. hence all the rules about only using chromatic/non-chord notes on weak beats etc that you find in every guide to melody writing.

Rhythm is the most indispensable element in music, since all music unfolds as s sequence of pitch/sound events.

feeling 2D though!

 

[dssdnt]

to be fair, "request line" also "carved out a new rhythmic space" too, using melody to imply rhythm - something grime (which request line aped) did and does well.

Though borderpolice has said it in a different way, I did wonder what Blackdown meant by the phrase "carved out a new rhythmic" space vis-a-vis mrl ? Care to elaborate? How did it imply rhythm any differently than any other track? If anything I'd say that those arpeggios were the opposite of "implying", they were so upfront as to be almost cutesy . . .

 

[gek-opel]

I presume he meant specifically that the fluttering synth arpeggios in the context of dubstep "implied" the faster rhythms of 2step in a similar manner to double-time hi-hats. Of course "implied" here means in relation to the "actual" of drums, beats, percussive rhythms. Though, obviously at the same time, melodic elements actually are just as rhythmic as percussion (appearing as events in time as Borderpolice points out).

Its the inverse of wobblestep, basically, where the doubletime rhythm is created by the modulation of the bass. In these two Skream tunes it is the rhythm of the prominent melody line...

Actually the most interesting thing about 2D is its lack of standard dubstep low end.

 

[Blackdown]

When you set the settings in a synth, there's four envelope parameters: attack, release, decay, and sustain or whatever. Depending how you set these, eight conseuctive eighth notes can either sound like eight individual hits or one continuous wash.

I guess my reference to "Request Line" was that the (arpeggiated) melody definitely added to the sense of momentum, whereas lots of dark textural dubstep that preceeded it relied more on drum hits for momentum (and dark synth washes for sense of mood).