Dodgy Bad Taste Warrior Queen Lyrics

[sodiumnightlife]

I hear Mavado's "George Galloway Freestyle" is pretty big on the island right now.

 

[zhao]

going back to one of your first posts on this thread, what do you mean by our underground? Who are this we? Do you believe in some underground music community which is striving together against the evil state?

simply youth culture in general. especially the maybe less co-opted end. a line like that from Lmp Bzkt wouldn't sound as out of place.

you often say you cant condemn a group of people (for instance muslims) for the actions of one individual, yet it seems you yourself are doing exactly that for the whole grime community. why is it ok to condemn the whole grime community for the supposedly dodgy lyrics of warrior queen?

errr... i said what something like that says about the scene, and not the scene is-- .
get me?

 

[zhao]

Yah, I know what it's about -- it came off like a bit of the infuriating "yes but-ism" that so many liberal/left people engage in. In any case it does spoil the mood of the song for me... like he's breaking character or something.

J-live's Not Satisfied does this "yes-but" thing at the end too.

 

[zhao]

so when i say that something like a suicide bombing in the name of islam says something about islam you would agree with that because i dont say "islam is..."

no. i would definitely say:

"suicide bombing make Muslims look like violent unreasonable terrorists"

similar to:

"this line makes grime mc's look like they can't critical think worth shit"

 

[zhao]

oh for fuck sake...

i would also say:

"suicide bombing says about Muslims that they are violent unreasonable fanatics"
as in -- "suicide bombing makes Islam look bad".

as i would say:

"a line like that says about Grime artists that they are uneducated and repeat what's on the telly"
as in -- "dodgy lyrics makes urban youths look bad"

GET ME NOW?!?!

 

[zhao]

of course suicide bombing looks bad for Muslims?!?!?!?

do you think that i think it looks GOOD for them????????

 

[zhao]

when something makes you look bad it says something about how things appear to be, but not necessarily are
when something says something about you it says something about how things are

ok i always meant the former. my use of "says about" is the same as "makes you look".

 

[straight]

this thread really makes me glad i spent the weekend in a cottage in wales, not the sort of craic an expat northern irishman should get embroiled in. Personally I find the crapness of her lyrics on 'check it' much more offensive.

 

[zhao]

this thread really makes me glad i spent the weekend in a cottage in wales, not the sort of craic an expat northern irishman should get embroiled in. Personally I find the crapness of her lyrics on 'check it' much more offensive.

why what does she say on that one?

 

[straight]

not a lot, i just listened to it for the first time in ages at the weekend and it doesnt work rhythmically, is really badly mixed (far too loud) and flat out ruined my favourite beat off the skream album

 

[noel emits]

Good morning everyone. I do hope this isn't getting too personal because I'd hate to see the spirit of a good petty discussion about song lyrics spoiled by taking it too seriously. Having said that...

Do you believe in some underground music community which is striving together against the evil state?

There did used to be this idea of a 'counterculture', and if we can still apply such a category (maybe you are saying you think we can't?) then I think even most people under 32 (!) would agree that the present countercultural zeitgeist holds that the press and the government can be rather full crap and that perhaps we should be cautious about thoughtlessly soaking up their hype phrases.

so when i say that something like a suicide bombing in the name of islam says something about islam you would agree with that because i dont say "islam is..."

The question for me is where did this idea of 'in the name of Islam' actually come from? The bombers said they were protesting about British troops killing people in Afghanistan and Iraq, as they saw it. It's related to Islam because the people and countries involved are but it's not exactly the same thing and that phrase to me comes across as one of those repeated slogans like 'war on terror', 'axis of evil' etc.. It's no big deal really, it's just a song, but that's why the line kind of stuck in my craw a bit and why I can understand zhao's getting riled by it too.

 

[noel emits]

i dont think you can include dancehall, grime and hiphop (and indie for that matter) in some kind of progressive counterculture, which for instance is wholesale against bush. I think you will find, especially in hiphop, but elsewhere as well, a lot of artists with a rather conservative look on things ("get rich quick" , "no homo")

Well if that's the case it's fucking sad and I totally stand against it. It's stupid and they've sold themselves down the river. Dumbasses. If that is the case.

and when i read zhao talking about "our underground artists" i hear some longing for a mythical 60's, which probably never existed in the first place.

Not to speak for zhao but I don't think it has anything to do with the 60s. It's NOW that people (yes, the kids) need to realise that THEY make the world and that simply reflecting and duplicating the crap that goes on around won't change anything. It's a cop-out, a lie of powerlessness that's been sold. Not my problem though because apparently people over 30 have nothing to offer or say to all the worldly wise 19 year old progressives out there.

 

[zhao]

i dont think you can include dancehall, grime and hiphop (and indie for that matter) in some kind of progressive counterculture, which for instance is wholesale against bush. I think you will find, especially in hiphop, but elsewhere as well, a lot of artists with a rather conservative look on things ("get rich quick" , "no homo")

and when i read zhao talking about "our underground artists" i hear some longing for a mythical 60's, which probably never existed in the first place.

good points. and and you are right, dancehall is not a part of an umbrella (western) "counter culture". but even jamaican music constantly say "we represent the gheto youths them", and regularly denounce "politricks" and corruption in the government. all of that and the proverbial anti-capitalist "bun babylon" makes it, in my eyes at least, ultimately a culture standing in opposition to state power.

but strictly speaking, Kevin Martin whose riddim she appears on is not "from" dancehall or grime or hiphop... I'm not sure what he was/is actually and if he fits into a semi-politicized western punk/ "counterculture"...

 

[fokse vektaire xeven]

i I think you will find, especially in hiphop, but elsewhere as well, a lot of artists with a rather conservative look on things ("get rich quick" , "no homo")

"I feel like a black republican, money I got comin in..."

 

[noel emits]

good points. and and you are right, dancehall is not a part of an umbrella (western) "counter culture".

I think the approach of 'it's not your culture, you don't have a say' is completely bogus (not that this is what people are saying here but it's related). It's another part of the spectatorising process of disengagement. Really, really there is only one culture, human culture, and everything is connected. If you perceive something then it is part of your world and you are involved.

 

[noel emits]

i dont think you can include dancehall, grime and hiphop (and indie for that matter) in some kind of progressive counterculture, which for instance is wholesale against bush. I think you will find, especially in hiphop, but elsewhere as well, a lot of artists with a rather conservative look on things ("get rich quick" , "no homo")

You'll also find artists with the opposite outlook. Positing the whole of black music (and indie) as reactionary or depoliticised isn't very accurate either. By definition the idea of a 'counterculture' is one of a kind of diffuse zeitgeist, not a monolith. Of course I can see how this doesn't necessarily translate across continents but we were talking about what is essentially a UK record.

 

[gumdrops]

the thing about something like the 7/7 bombings or muslim terrrorism in general though is that its seen as 'foreign' issues by 'foreign' people and therefore a lot of people are probably less empathetic to it, even ppl like warrior queen who is from an ethnic minority, and far as i know, not british-raised either.

yeah its wrong to see all black music as socialist/revolutionary/anti establishment etc, but a fair amount of the music over the years HAS leant towards that sort of viewpoint (i dont think its inaccurate to say that the general stance of hip hop from about 86 if not earlier through to 96 was firmly anti-establishment). these days of course, probably cos the music hasnt been about that for so long, most modern artists dont have a politically provocative bone in their body or if they do, they arent willing/confident to expose it (and half the time, its just uninteresting when they do anyway).

 

[noel emits]

People tend to think artists, and especially rebelling artists must by definition be left wing progressives, but this just isnt always the case. Ian Curtis voted Thatcher, Johnny Ramone supported the Republican Party, as did Neil Young for a period. I think i heard Iggy Pop say last year he was a Republican.

The left is eager to appropriate "youth culture", but that doesnt mean youth culture is left wing

Awareness of the processes of government and media isn't to do with how somebody votes. It's not a 'left wing' position.

 

[noel emits]

and is something i didnt do. I merely said you cant call it an progressive underground culture as a whole.

No I'm drawing a parallel between this and the equally fallacious notion that a counterculture is 'wholesale against Bush' for instance. Just saying it doesn't work like that, there's no official line as such.

 

[noel emits]

so you believe in a counterculure in music where artists are aware of the the processes of government and media and write lyrics with that knowledge in mind? and most artists in dancehall/grime/hiphop/indie belong to this category?

What do mean by 'believe'? Do I think it exists? Or would I like it to be the case?

I'm just clarifying that saying that something someone says betrays a (momentary, we all do it sometimes) lack of media savvy and critical thinking is not the same as saying someone is 'right wing', or even depolitcised. You know, I'm just talking about a little basic awareness from people who choose to speak out about these things.

It's fine if you are happy that all your favourite grime / dancehall / hip hop artists couldn't give a shit about such things. Many do of course, and as it happens those tend to be the ones I'll listen to more. But in terms of what I demand of artists then I can make my criticism.