Martin Dust
Techno Zen Master
Martin Webster if I remember correctly, he's still writing NS newsletters.
Rock Against Racism '08
- Thread starter martin
- Start date
Martin Webster if I remember correctly, he's still writing NS newsletters.
Great, I don't know shit, cheers professor. I'll keep it zipped in future.
Ah, fuck this forum, I'm off. I just wanted to see what people thought about RAR, ie- waste of time? outdated entertainment form? something positive? - not get slated as a closet misogynist on the basis of a word (that I've used umpteen times on here, and so have others) by some lazy fucking American DJ. Incidentally, I didn't go to RAR yesterday cos seeing Don Letts, Paul Simonon and Jimmy Pursey on stage is the equivalent of George Formby and Vera Lynn performing at the original one in '78.
Ah, fuck this forum, I'm off. I just wanted to see what people thought about RAR, ie- waste of time? outdated entertainment form? something positive? - not get slated as a closet misogynist on the basis of a word (that I've used umpteen times on here, and so have others) by some lazy fucking American DJ. Incidentally, I didn't go to RAR yesterday cos seeing Don Letts, Paul Simonon and Jimmy Pursey on stage is the equivalent of George Formby and Vera Lynn performing at the original one in '78.
vimothy
yurp
what if you use the word "neo-liberal" to mean whatever you wish it to mean?
Touche. It's true though, neo-liberal means pretty much whatever anyone wants it to mean. Ditto neo-conservative.
john eden
male pale and stale
It's been an interesting discussion I think.
What is different now, maybe, is that we can look back on a tradition of of active anti-racism in music. So perhaps it's useful for "kids of today" to see that the influences on the music that they like were actively involved with anti-racist struggles.
On the other hand maybe young people don't want guys the same age as their dads lecturing them from the stage - but being old I find this pretty conservative and ahistorical. Perhaps the issue is the content of what they say and the qualityof the music and not how old they are I dunno.
Nobody would bat an eyelid if the Abyssinians sang "Truth and Rights" at an anti-racist carnival and they are way older than Jimmy Pursey.
In terms of whether it is effective I have mixed feelings. Basically I am in favour of people coming together for a free festival and being exposed to different music and sometimes the basics need restating.
On the other hand it seems to me that there is a lot less casual racism around in 2008 than there was 30 years ago. So I would imagine that there is even more preaching to the converted going on than at the 1st one.
As has I think been said above, contemporary fascism is no longer about controlling the streets so there is less need for people to come together en masse and realise their collective strength (although - again, this is a good thing in and of itself).
So to sum up - racism is different now, fascism is different now. A different kind of opposition is probably needed now. But until that happens the odd free festival isn't such a bad thing.
i thought it was a bit embarassing and rubbish (not to mention, er, racist?) that in radio 4's coverage of the RAR thing this morning the people they interviewed and mentioned were all white except david mcalmont - jimmy pursey (actually i've no idea if he's white, but i assume so), damon albarn, the clash, don letts, hardfi, babyshambles etc. would've been nice to hear wiley et al go head to head with john humphrys
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
So do you think Wiley wanted to go on the show, but was denied? Or just not invited in the first place? Or did he perhaps view the whole thing (RAR, I mean) as a gig like any other?
I suppose what I'm getting at is: is it possible that racism as an issue these days is something that bothers well-meaning white folks more than it bothers a lot of black and Asian people? I'm certainly not saying this is the case, I just thought it might be worth exploring...
crackerjack
Well-known member
I got down for the last hour to see Good, The Bad, The Queen. Them apart the stuff from the stage was like a timewarp - union leaders making speeches about unity, Jerry Dammers (who now speaks in a very cockney accent, btw) DJing with Police & thieves and Slavery Days
random blokes trying to lead the crowd in chants of "fuck the BNP" didn't really get anywhere. there was a sense of disconnect between the audience and the event, i thought. sure everyone there thinks racism is bad and the BNP are arseholes - they just dont want to be lectured on it while waiting in the rain for bands to come on. i imagine most people went away thinking it was a decnet day out, for free
the finale kind summed things up - dammers came on with a massive horn section, introduced Kode 9 to do a version of Ghost Town which he said was the only one he'd heard since his own that wasn't crap. It was reeeeeeaaaallly slow, kept slowly building like it was gonna go off - and then stopped. it was like it closed on a shaggy dog story.
crackerjack
Well-known member
don letts is black (at least in part)
yeah, actually i think i got that doubly wrong as i meant jerry dammers not don letts being referred to on the radio 4 thing, i always confuse those two for some reason. and i've got no idea what either of them look like.
i'd assume radio 4 simply didn't invite wiley as their demographic is basically middle aged white people who know who the abovementioned people are and don't know or care about wiley, bashy, chipmunk, whoever else was playing yesterday (i think the age thing is more important than the race thing in this case anyway)
i know what you mean, i'm sure wiley doesn't care about not being on radio 4, but whichever way you look at it, doing a feature on a love music hate racism gig and only banging on about old white (ish) guys seems a bit weird?
i'd assume radio 4 simply didn't invite wiley as their demographic is basically middle aged white people who know who the abovementioned people are and don't know or care about wiley, bashy, chipmunk, whoever else was playing yesterday (i think the age thing is more important than the race thing in this case anyway)
i know what you mean, i'm sure wiley doesn't care about not being on radio 4, but whichever way you look at it, doing a feature on a love music hate racism gig and only banging on about old white (ish) guys seems a bit weird?
mos dan
fact music
possibly tangential to your point, but i'm sure i read on grimeforum that wiley didn't show.. did any of the grime youngers perform?
bit lame of me not to make it along, i had work to do
seems pretty standard to me.
Grievous Angel
Beast of Burden
the point of having old white guys in lmhr is to get exposure in media outlets that will run those people on account of their recognisability and articulacy.
pr lesson #1 - don't have a spokesperson your target audience don't know about / care about / understand.
pr lesson #1 - don't have a spokesperson your target audience don't know about / care about / understand.
Transpontine
history is made at night
I went along for a bit - made me think I was too young for the first RAR festival in Vcitoria Park and too old for the new one as lots of 14 year olds ran around watching The View.
I thought as a musical event it didn't really work, the sound was really quiet even close to the main stage. Some of the speeches were embarrassing too. Bashy interjected a bit of atmosphere, but couldn't go wrong as he was bashing out indie boucealong samples like Franz Ferdinand, Nirvana, Blur and Eurythmics.
I thought as a musical event it didn't really work, the sound was really quiet even close to the main stage. Some of the speeches were embarrassing too. Bashy interjected a bit of atmosphere, but couldn't go wrong as he was bashing out indie boucealong samples like Franz Ferdinand, Nirvana, Blur and Eurythmics.