nnazem

Well-known member
hey, i don't know if anyone posted anything about this, but can you recommend any chicagoan footwork events? i'm definitely going to be in chicagoland at some point this summer, and while last year's juke/footwork mixtape search-out failed miserably due to time constraints, i'd still be really into checking out an event in person. obviously this is way in advance, but yeah. just throwing it out there.

Yeah, there's 2 big footwork events that happen in Chicago, and they both happen on sundays.

One is Warzone, aka the wala cam parties. These start during the evening hours on the west side.

The other is Battlegroundz, which is usually from 9pm - 2am.

PM me so I know when you get in town so I can show you around, and introduce you to some people.
 

nnazem

Well-known member
all this chicagoan dj nate hate is really sounding like a personal grudge at this point.

besides, we wouldn't even be focusing so much on him if it weren't for all this controversy.

i really wish i didn't spend this much of my time talking about nate either. I was just trying to keep up my reputation, as well as the reputation of chicago music. then again, i'm trying to defend myself against someone whose made nearly 5500 posts on dissensus in 6 years, close to 1000 a year.

I realize now the error of my ways, haha.
 

dave quam

Well-known member
"Your posts there were very reasonable up to this point. No need for that. "

True probably no need, but no need for this forum ether. Will continue sharing music on zee blog.

I never heard of this forum until my friend pointed me to this thread. Scared to check the others.

Though I checked one called house music sucks unfortunately.
 

mms

sometimes
By the way why the LOLZ from a guy who is obviously in his 40s about my DJ Roc comment? He is one of the guys who grew up along with Rashad and Spinn who was also clutch to the music's development. Did you not see my huge list of stuff I like from early Dance Mania till 2010 from before? I think it was pretty clear that I like plenty of DJs and not just Rashad and Spinn. Neema's introduced me to a handful of them too.

I will add one to that list, DJ T RELL. A fucking monster.

I felt like sharing more good stuff with you guys but so many of your are so goddamn retarded and don't want to learn anything about a genre they are so interested that I don't give a shit.

dunno if this is directed at me cos you and naseem are so indirect
i'm nowhere near my 40's, i started buying dance music 12's when i was 12-13

i think we all know now that dj nate is 'bad', even though we listen ourselves and it's great. we also know he stopped doing footwork ages ago but we knew that, we know that you two think loads of other people who aren't your friends are rubbish etc and the people you like are the true people and you have the evidence to back it up, but music is music, people will pick the stuff they like up as i was trying to explain, but got nowhere.....

not really seen you representing many of the other artists on this thread cos so much energy here has been directed at slagging off all but a handful of artists that its hard to know what YOU GUYS ARE ACTUALLY REALLY ENJOYING beyond 3 artists.

regarding your dubstep comment - nah we don't get that upset really, it doesn't matter that much as long as people continue to get recognition like they do, brits seem to support each other too, and represent each other as artists, as self organising groups, i can't see that happening here at all really, sadly, it's like you two guys are acting like its some kinda turf war on the internet, it seems rather childish, and unreasonable, but then maybe you've been getting a head full of steam lately, it would seem so from your stupid words on and off the net. I really wonder if the artists themselves support some of these ideas and comments, as i said before i really doubt it.

I'm pretty sure that footwork will get the releases and spotlight it deserves as long as the people representing it go with it - it's just dj nate is the first one up, and thats mainly cos people outside parts of chicago are into him. its as simple a that really, ive said this about 4 times now.
 
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dave quam

Well-known member
I was buying Dance Mania records since the label was birthed, and I'm only 12 years old it's crazy.
 
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mms

sometimes
I was buying Dance Mania records since the label was birthed, and I'm only 12 years old it's crazy.

this is what i said:
'i've been buying chicago records since 1989 i have the first dance mania releases on vinyl from 1985.'
we have second hand shops in the uk as i imagine you do in the US, lols i picked up the missing records later as you do.
so don't twist my words, quite clearly you've lost it, my post was a reasonable one and the points i've been raising are reasonable points.

A history lesson from the brits side - 1987 jack your body by steve silk hurley was no one for weeks in the uk - he didn't have a video so the national chart programme top of the pops showed some chopped and edited footage of old chicago dancing - other number ones and top 30's were things like lil louis - then promised land etc - alot of chicago records were easily available in regular shops that just sold chart music, on dj international etc, chicago house was the most popular dance music in the uk, even stock aitken and waterman got in on the act with people like mel and kim and also 'the reynolds girls' with their (s) hit - i'd rather jack (than fleetwood mac) it was huuggee, not an underground thing at all, bigger than jungle or dubstep or whatever...

before that if you look at it - brits always bought the rare groove and 'northern' soul ( a british term for rare soul that was popular in the north of england) so brits relationship to Chicago or Us music has been one of piecing together stories thru the music that we get. We aren't in the same geographic area, so its actively finding this music in the dark quite often it's not disrespect, it's the fact that the music is usually made with local areas in mind, and to an extent the popularity of artists over here relies on people liking the records alot, or whatever they can get - youtube now with this..... it's a process that you guys may not understand too.

Btw just got the wire - which has a piece on dj nate in it - no where does he make the claim that he's still currently active in footwork - cites traxman and dj roc as influences....
 
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massrock

Well-known member
Regardless of the various merits or otherwise of the pieces mentioned it should be said that most jobs don't pay enough to allow writers to always do definitive research, so sometimes it comes down to writing something or nothing at all. If you have something to say maybe try pitching a few pieces? I know it's not always that simple but many places online happy for good content if they don't have to pay for it. People aren't getting paid to post here.

Also wouldn't the 'youtube kids' relationship to the 'more accomplished' or 'musical' producers be more comparable to that of say early Benga and Skream to Artwork and El-B than that of Rusko to Mala or something? Still, comparisons maybe not very helpful here and I realise it's not strictly an age or chronology thing.
 

Amicose

Well-known member
I think there's a few things going on here. We can all accept you Chicago guys frustration at under researched articles in dry magazines way out from the epicentre. Shit that you care about and put a lot of energy and time into has been sent to the work experience boys who prepare articles full of fluff and misinformation. Those articles will keep cropping up; only way round it is to pitch them first.

Also I garanfuckingtee in a mirror universe if it were a bunch of Chicago cats talking about some UK-based scene you were apart of it would be the same reaction. You guys take your music pretty seriously too you know. Also if you came here and realized how terrible the club scene was, how much bullshit you have to deal with to get a gig here, and how broke some of this cities best musicians are, Neema might not come off like a jukenazi

This also rings true. Not a complete parallel, and though we all know dubstep's long gone, it's hard not to despair at another Borgore or Mt Eden.
I lived in London almost 10 years. When I arrived, yeah, I went Oxford Street & bought just-released Kid A and got into Aphex Twin. But you spend a while there, you acclimatise to the city's sonics & movements & populations & if you're into the music, develop pretty deep instincts as to how the city's music relates back to all that. There's a lot at stake there, and bullshit has to be fought. (eg anyone seen that film Shank? Only seen the trailer, but, jesus.)
mms, the guys are fighting against real threats here. Misinformation & bullshit abounds, and then there's the diplo vultures hovring around waiting to dry hump and eviscerate some shit that's localy and structurally and important. Turf does come into that.

don't want to learn anything about a genre they are so interested that I don't give a shit.

The problem is here, talking about learning and education. Most posters here seem like musically curious people. Personally I've only ever posted on this thread because it's the only one really heading out into territory unknown and undocumented anywhere else, and I feel weird talking for us collectively, but whatever. People here will pore over whatever's put in front of them, but no-one's going to reject the reaction we had when we first found the stuff. In my case that was Nate, RP Boo, Solo & Spinn, but mostly Nate. I spent a whole evening ripping the shit of utube - the only place I could find it - and listened to it at night on a coach on the way to an airport. Listened to Give Dat Man Room on repeat staring down at the demarcation of fields over the south east UK. It was strong shit and I tripped out. Music is just as much to do with these sorts of events as my 10 year event in London, and I'm not going to be educated out of that moment.

Kids and adults do make music in different ways, too. Elmoe can do things - pretty subtle things, true - that Roc can't do, vice versa. I love both these guys btw, and I'm certainly not trying to oppose them. I don't know Roc's bio but I get the impression that he's been around a while, his stuffs lean & concentrated, well chosen elements and well fucking put together. Work dis pussy samples a bit of synth from Crossroads by bone thugs, shit still propels. Elmoe samples the X files theme and puts together some weird, woozy shit, thrown together in a way you can only do when you're young. Both guys have made some accomplished shit.

The Aphex comparisons are not totally lame either. In the early 90's I was 10 years old & definitely not active in IDM cirlcles, but my understanding is that there was this pervasive idea (still undefeated f we go by that BBU article dave q mentioned) that dance music is mindless. So these guys took the template and made some shit that's active straight on the brain. Didn't Aphex call it Braindance? Then we've got grime; excluded from the clubs and dances by a racist police force it concentrated on the radio, became a tool for MC. My understanding of juke and footwork is that it doesn't cater to big communal parties, everyone facing the DJ, etc. It's for guys to dance in a circle against one another.
All three of these instances, big shared-consciousness dance music got more self conscious and shed its easily danceable elements to pursue something else.

You and Neema are obviously dedicated & eneregetic guys and I've got a lot of time for that. That's another reason I want to check out more RP Boo stuff; I found an interview again on utube where the Boo's imploring everyone to get together and build some shit, and still he makes some of the starkest, coldest stuff I've ever heard, and I've only every heard maybe 5 of 6 tracks I know definitely are his. If I lived anywhere in the Eastern US I'd be straight on the greyhound or domestic flight & be checking this stuff out first hand, but that's not an option. So there's the internet, which is a real place where you can spend real time, and it's just absurd that I should have to validate whatever experience I've had with the music there.
 

dave quam

Well-known member
It is true, MMS is a manchild that is too retarded to handle that that my comments and constant approval of Youtube kids got swept away in his manliness. I apologize, for he is completely a total retard but also a middle age troll. He also managed to spend his time trying to put dirt on me it seems and is nothing but both the oldest but also stupidest person on this forum.

But anyways

an amazing RP Boo track http://www.sendspace.com/file/4bbf0r
 

alex

Do not read this.
Yea I got to say I havent took Give Dat Man Room off of my Ipod since I aquired it.

Mind you, can say the same for all of Clent/Rashads releases/rips..

Been kaning 'Beat It' in house sets recently, its a great transition track.
 

mms

sometimes
It is true, MMS is a manchild that is too retarded to handle that that my comments and constant approval of Youtube kids got swept away in his manliness. I apologize, for he is completely a total retard but also a middle age troll. He also managed to spend his time trying to put dirt on me it seems and is nothing but both the oldest but also stupidest person on this forum.

But anyways

an amazing RP Boo track http://www.sendspace.com/file/4bbf0r

eh? whats this about - i'm 34 ! :), no need to go into one about this.

i just went into an explanation for you regarding brit relationship with chicago - music wuse - i'm trying to show you what its like from our side, trying to be reasonable here, please read it might enlighten you a bit.

i'm not bothered about your silly comments , i imagine you're shaking at your keyboard and probably need to get off the computer and chill the fuck out really.

but i'd really like you to read what ive said and absorb it, maybe you will understand where we are coming from as much as we're trying to understand you?
 
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Amicose

Well-known member
For the record I think that mms is taking sense re: brits picking up little threads and scraps of US and trying to build up a picture. A lot of us were getting a vibe of, if you're not at Chicago you're just not getting it, which is a vibe I'm not up for.

Sweet on the RP track. There's a 70mb aiff of this that I took on the plane..
 

dave quam

Well-known member
I'm not going to absorb anything and absolutely not your goddamn diaper. Explain the UK scene in relationship to Chicago and I will give you a gold star or probably....nothing. You have done a good job explaining neither.
 

mms

sometimes
I'm not going to absorb anything and absolutely not your goddamn diaper. Explain the UK scene in relationship to Chicago and I will give you a gold star or probably....nothing. You have done a good job explaining neither.

tsh boom.......ok i think you hit the jackpot there, frankly you're looking more and more like a bully and a real asshole, while everyone around you is trying to show you a bigger picture.
take time out.
 

Amicose

Well-known member
A lot of us were getting a vibe of, if you're not at Chicago you're just not getting it, which is a vibe I'm not up for.

to elaborate a bit on this stark comment, this is complicated by the fact that more than strictly for dancing 80's house we're talking about a music in which a sense of place (like geolocation & tha circle) is totally embedded but still, we can bring what we know about place generally to compensate for what we don't know about chicago.
 
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mms

sometimes
well the thing is no one is wrong here, perspectives are different, access is different, precidents etc are different thats all really, just its not as simple as one side being wrong or needing to be educated, at the end of the day too music is a weird form of magic.. lol.
 
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Amicose

Well-known member
Music, especially dance music, involves more than just subjective experience, though. DJ can only play what the people will dance to, you know?
Metal for example is cross continental and there are pockets in Łódź, LA, Tel Aviv, Birmingham, everywhere. Juke is pretty absolutely from Chicago and so is going to communicate a lot about where it's from and I think that, pretty reasonably, is where Dave Quam/Neema are coming from.
 

mms

sometimes
Music, especially dance music, involves more than just subjective experience, though. DJ can only play what the people will dance to, you know?
Metal for example is cross continental and there are pockets in Łódź, LA, Tel Aviv, Birmingham, everywhere. Juke is pretty absolutely from Chicago and so is going to communicate a lot about where it's from and I think that, pretty reasonably, is where Dave Quam/Neema are coming from.

of course it is, and of course music isn't entirely subjective, although at the end of the day, people wil make their mind up about what they like esp when they are piecing together something in the dark, i welcome their comments here but im really sick and frustrated with the name calling and the perspective that only a small number of artists that they seem to be friends with or semi professionally involved in are the real footwork or whatever it is, and everyone else is nothing... and no other perspectives matter, cos they're wrong....sorry if thats not entirely the case with dave quam and i have said that, before he started acting like he worked for fox news, but there is a definite sense of siege mentality and pettiness here, and the thing is, the good stuff will get the recognition it deserves, if the whole thing doesn't implode with the kinda chat seen here.
I know quam and naseem are trying to represent footwork but im also wondering what the artists perspective on their scene is too, whether they back up their views, as although they don't recognise it, they're skewering the perspective too.
 
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