The feel of the 2010's

[Mr. Tea]

Skittish, fickle youth with no core beliefs. Loud and saying nothing. Adrift and at the whims of the corporate tides. No joy, just glazed eyes looking for the next 2 second rush. Never missing a beat to produce a perfect smile and portrayal of joy when the camera is pointed at them for their IG, though. All of the online stuff like social networks, apps, and virtual music genres etc, just totally lame. Disconnected. Overflowing petri dishes of delusion. Before all this, back when people's feet were a little closer to the ground and they knew how to actually be together (before awkwardness became a major cultural trope) there was always a healthy amount of subversion threaded throughout pop culture. A nudge and a wink.

Isn't this just the current variation on what grumpy mums and dads have been saying for centuries, though? I'm pretty sure serious grown-ups in the 19th century huffed and puffed about the deleterious effects of popular novels on young people's minds, just like you're doing about social media.

I mean, I'm not saying you're wrong, exactly - I think some fairly robust studies have concluded that the more exposed to social media kids are, the less happy they're likely to be, and it's so ubiquitous that its effects can hardly be insignificant - but the general tone is something every generation feels the need to express, apparently, once it's no longer da yoot.

 

[shakahislop]

the shift to autofictionification happened in the 2010s. in books obviously but in everything else as well, from insta to tunes.

personally i'm all for it.

 

[shakahislop]

the 2010s is when everybody got a laptop, and recording music became more democratic than its ever been. musically its the most dominant trend across all genres; the laptop being the instrument of choice, and the mode of music-making being sitting alone on a computer.

 

[shakahislop]

two 20th century artforms, recorded music and hollywood films, fell from grace in the 2010s. they were made possible by a technological innovation in the first place, and then got the shit kicked out of them by another technological innovation. they were the hugely profitable dead center of culture, the big ones, unassailable. and now they're not.

 

[Mr. Tea]

the 2010s is when everybody got a laptop, and recording music became more democratic than its ever been. musically its the most dominant trend across all genres; the laptop being the instrument of choice, and the mode of music-making being sitting alone on a computer.

Guilty as charged!

 

[craner]

Maybe 'populism' is a misleading shorthand. The Biden administration is also misleading, I think (and I wouldn't really say that Starmer is at the fore of anything or guarateed the kind of era-defining significance of New Labour).

For the 2020s I would say the defining, active mobilisations come from fringes, the fringes invading, undermining, hollowing out of the mainstream and the centre. The question is, if this is the 2020s, what was the 2010s? Did it set the scene and establish the tools for the coming 'decade'? Was that it's purpose? Or was it something else?

In talking about the 2010s, you end up talking more about the 2020s. The 2020s seem to be easier to define, to delineate, even if some of the terms are misleading.

Populism doesn't quite capture it because it's not necessarily about the rise and fall of specific parties or individuals or even a kind of neo-populism that can be defined by academics. It is more about a general reaction to the exposure and failures of the 9/11 wars and the repercussions of the 2008 financial crisis: ultimately, the destruction of the orthodoxies of liberalism and free market economics combined with the destruction of the concept of objectivity and faith in a shared concept of truth on a popular, instinctive level.

Conspiracy theories, "alternative facts", accessible fringe media supplanting mainstream channels, the scrambling of established political categories, etc.: all of these things are visible and gestating in the 2010s, but they are not quite of it.

Similarly, the true implications of massively increased mobile and internet power only truly started to define the culture in the 2020s, if you say that the 2020s begin in 2016. The political and anthropological effects suddenly become manifest, tangible, inescapable. Non-coincidentally, all the old orders and categories begin to rapidly disintegrate.

 

[maxi]

In talking about the 2010s, you end up talking more about the 2020s. The 2020s seem to be easier to define, to delineate, even if some of the terms are misleading.

Populism doesn't quite capture it because it's not necessarily about the rise and fall of specific parties or individuals or even a kind of neo-populism that can be defined by academics. It is more about a general reaction to the exposure and failures of the 9/11 wars and the repercussions of the 2008 financial crisis: ultimately, the destruction of the orthodoxies of liberalism and free market economics combined with the destruction of the concept of objectivity and faith in a shared concept of truth on a popular, instinctive level.

Conspiracy theories, "alternative facts", accessible fringe media supplanting mainstream channels, the scrambling of established political categories, etc.: all of these things are visible and gestating in the 2010s, but they are not quite of it.

Similarly, the true implications of massively increased mobile and internet power only truly started to define the culture in the 2020s, if you say that the 2020s begin in 2016. The political and anthropological effects suddenly become manifest, tangible, inescapable. Non-coincidentally, all the old orders and categories begin to rapidly disintegrate.

going by your framework of 2020s = 2016 onwards, and 2010s = 2008-2016,

then the 2010s are defined by recession, austerity, disillusionment (particularly with obama) and peak neoliberalism reaching a breaking point. the collapse before the chaos

 

[craner]

One thing we don't have, but could very much do with, compared to the last 20s is a riotous, invigorating culture explosion. An equal and opposite reaction to the exterior forces at play. This is the barometer for where we're at wrt the human spirit rn. The stuffing has been kicked out. Pop culture has been so heavily neutered, both by the hands of the 3 major labels that run everything and the majority of artists and producers who follow formulas purely to make money/gain fame. Stats fed, ego-based mentality thanks to the net. In music, whatever alternative/experimental/non-conformist was, has now been consumed by the mainstream aside from a few outliers like gabber and psytrance, but they're very lame and the former is most likely a flash in the pan anyway. This is what makes now so boring imo. Fruitless intensity. Skittish, fickle youth with no core beliefs. Loud and saying nothing. Adrift and at the whims of the corporate tides. No joy, just glazed eyes looking for the next 2 second rush. Never missing a beat to produce a perfect smile and portrayal of joy when the camera is pointed at them for their IG, though. All of the online stuff like social networks, apps, and virtual music genres etc, just totally lame. Disconnected. Overflowing petri dishes of delusion. Before all this, back when people's feet were a little closer to the ground and they knew how to actually be together (before awkwardness became a major cultural trope) there was always a healthy amount of subversion threaded throughout pop culture. A nudge and a wink. There were enough rebels within the ranks of the major film studios and record labels that you had dissidence slipping through the censorship nets all over the place. That's one thing I feel we lost somewhere toward the end of the 90s. That sense of humor about life and all it's fucking daftness. Maybe around the bling era? That collective sense, the for the people sense that there is a fight to be fought. And it doesn't have to be overtly political. It can be as simple as conveying 'let's ave it.' But somewhere along the way we got complacent and the rug was pulled from under us and we didn't even realize 'til it was too late.

The problem with these kind of conversations is, I guess, the tendency to try to evaluate each decade or era within the frame of personal values or preferences. It's true that things were shit then, they are shit now and they are probably going to get shitter unless the hacienda is built. But it's easier to try to work out what might distinguish decades if you extract nostalgia or disappointment.

Maybe that suggests the distinction between the 10s and 20s. In the 2010s there were no utopias and all the escape hatches had been sealed shut. It was just disengagement, despondency, despair. But in 2016, in the ruins of the old orders, the belief in utopias, revolutions, new dawns, saviors and redeemers was a significant cultural and political reality. I mean, nobody expected it, but that made the fact that it was real even more significant.

 

[craner]

going by your framework of 2020s = 2016 onwards, and 2010s = 2008-2016,

then the 2010s are defined by recession, austerity, disillusionment (particularly with obama) and peak neoliberalism reaching a breaking point. the collapse before the chaos

Yes it was a period of retrenchment and reconsolidation on the part of financial and state forces after a series of massive shocks. The incomprehension evident in 2016 was partly because they truly believed this had worked.

Another part of this is the possibility that there was no 2010s. It was a lost decade. A phantom decade. A decade with no definition. Not so much ambiguity (as @linebaugh puts it) as absence. The old world had blown up or fallen apart and the new world had not yet emerged.

 

[maxi]

The problem with these kind of conversations is, I guess, the tendency to try to evaluate each decade or era within the frame of personal values or preferences. It's true that things were shit then, they are shit now and they are probably going to get shitter unless the hacienda is built. But it's easier to try to work out what might distinguish decades if you extract nostalgia or disappointment.

Maybe that suggests the distinction between the 10s and 20s. In the 2010s there were no utopias and all the escape hatches had been sealed shut. It was just disengagement, despondency, despair. But in 2016, in the ruins of the old orders, the belief in utopias, revolutions, new dawns, saviors and redeemers was not a significant cultural and political reality. I mean, nobody expected it, but that made the fact that it was real even more significant.

yes but then that hope was snuffed out again in the early 2020s. massive tory win and starmer taking over labour, sanders destroyed by his own party, BLM protests descending into statue debates and sloganeering with no real change, subsequent restrictions on protesting in the UK, covid and its handling, psychological effects of isolation, the closing down of clubs and smaller venues, climate protesters seemingly hated by everyone, war in ukraine and the foregrounding of imminent nuclear catastrophe again.

this is definitely filtered through my personal values of course, but it seems like the response to all this stuff from a lot of people has been to disengage and try not to think about it, unlike in the late 2010s. even conservatives were disillusioned by the boris johnson/tory debacles. that's why I mentioned the return of apathy

 

[craner]

yes but then that hope was snuffed out again in the early 2020s. massive tory win and starmer taking over labour, sanders destroyed by his own party, BLM protests descending into statue debates and sloganeering with no real change, subsequent restrictions on protesting in the UK, covid and its handling, psychological effects of isolation, the closing down of clubs and smaller venues, climate protesters seemingly hated by everyone, war in ukraine and the foregrounding of imminent nuclear catastrophe again.

this is definitely filtered through my personal values of course, but it seems like the response to all this stuff from a lot of people has been to disengage and try not to think about it, unlike in the late 2010s. even conservatives were disillusioned by the boris johnson/tory debacles. that's why I mentioned the return of apathy

I don't think that apathy about mainstream political parties in the UK means that those frustrations or sentiments or resentments or paranoias have disappeared or even dissipated. MAGAworld is still packed with True Believers and Trump is almost certain to be the Republican nominee. Poland, Hungary, Italy remain in the vanguard. The thing about the choices people make is that it's not always (or just) about hope, it's also about hate. It's as much about tearing all the old things down as creating the Kingdom of Heaven. This is a decade of destruction and salvation. The noughties was a period of deep apathy. The 2010s was a festering interval, a phoney restoration.

 

[sus]

Everyone except a few nutters accepting the inevitability of catastrophic climate change.

This doesn't seem to be true, in my experience! People pay lip service but that doesn't mean anything. It's just noise. Real estate prices in flood-prone areas of NYC, for instance, haven't budged (nor has NYC real estate generally). If people actually believed in inevitable catastrophic climate change, there'd be mass migrations and major economic crashes right now as people dropped threatened assets.

(This is all separate from whether catastrophic climate change is inevitable.)

 

[Mr. Tea]

I see that more as a rise and fall though, now that biden and starmer are at the fore since 2020. who knows what will happen next though.

Support for populist politics 'collapsed' during the pandemic – global report

Support for populist parties and politicians, and agreement with populist sentiment, has diminished during the pandemic, according to a “mega-dataset” taking in attitudes of over half a million people across 109 countries since 2020.

www.cam.ac.uk

"threats posed by the pandemic saw a “technocratic” shift in political authority worldwide, with increased trust in government, and in experts such as scientists and civil servants. Yet faith in the democratic processes by which people elect their representatives has continued to falter."

Interesting that they've included Boris Johnson among the 'non-populist' premiers - I'd have put him on the populist side, personally. Not to the extent of Trump or Bolsonaro, but probably closer to those guys than to, say, Merkel or Trudeau.

 

[maxi]

on another note, this fella deserves a mention

 

[pattycakes_]

Isn't this just the current variation on what grumpy mums and dads have been saying for centuries, though? I'm pretty sure serious grown-ups in the 19th century huffed and puffed about the deleterious effects of popular novels on young people's minds, just like you're doing about social media.

Yes, but it goes much further back.

I mean, I'm not saying you're wrong, exactly - I think some fairly robust studies have concluded that the more exposed to social media kids are, the less happy they're likely to be, and it's so ubiquitous that its effects can hardly be insignificant - but the general tone is something every generation feels the need to express, apparently, once it's no longer da yoot.

Yes, it was ever thus, but also, it really wasn't. The internet has totally dissolved all previous paradigms. Evolution sped up several orders of magnitude. The same can be said about the printing press, the radio, and the TV, but none of those were so engulfing or relentlessly shapeshifting. None of them were so attuned to our psyches en masse. We're at a point where all the fields of knowledge on how we work have culminated and formed this perfect harvesting machine with us willingly providing the data. This machine has the power to influence almost every aspect of our lives. 100 fold more so than TV ever did.

So no, I don't think it's exactly the same because, during both of our youths, there was something within popular culture that represented dissent against dark forces, and it was convincing. It was in rock, hiphop, house, techno, electro, industrial etc etc. A wide web of subversion made for and by young people. We had a sense of who we were and we made music and films that represented that and it was powerful. The forces will always be there to be rebelled against. But right now, among the majority of youth, it no longer exists, and as far as I can see, there isn't much effort to put it there or even demand for it. So what I would assume is that it takes some creative outliers to strike the sparks and influence their generation. But when the generation has grown up addicted to short attention span dopamine hits and how many likes their latest post got, what are the hopes?

Totally new playing field.

 

[sus]

Omaha, Nebraska and Charlotte, North Carolina are good bets—tons of rainfall at elevation. Detroit, Indianapolis, Memphis, Cleveland, Columbus, St. Louis, Atlanta, Pittsburgh, Minneapolis.

People will say Denver, but there's not much rainfall actually. The rest of the elevated US cities are in the desert (Tucson, Phoenix, El Paso, Fort Worth).

 

[craner]

To recalibrate, yes we are roused. Lots of movements and rage all around. But also a lot more division than I've ever seen in my life. People are losing the ability to communicate healthily.

Is this breakdown in communication and the proliferating and deepening social divisions precisely a symptom of the end of apathy?

 

[maxi]

Interesting that they've included Boris Johnson among the 'non-populist' premiers - I'd have put him on the populist side, personally. Not to the extent of Trump or Bolsonaro, but probably closer to those guys than to, say, Merkel or Trudeau.

yeah he's like trump and netanyahu in that he ultimately didn't really have any politics other than power for its own sake

 

[Mr. Tea]

This doesn't seem to be true, in my experience! People pay lip service but that doesn't mean anything. It's just noise. Real estate prices in flood-prone areas of NYC, for instance, haven't budged (nor has NYC real estate generally). If people actually believed in inevitable catastrophic climate change, there'd be mass migrations and major economic crashes right now as people dropped threatened assets.

(This is all separate from whether catastrophic climate change is inevitable.)

I didn't mean everyone is becoming a doomsday prepper or anything like that. And there are mass migrations: witness the ongoing migrant/refugee crisis in the Med, and to a lesser extent the English Channel - isn't there a more or less constant influx of people heading north across the US-Mexican border too? Most people don't have "assets", as such. Record numbers of people are deciding not to have kids. A number of developed countries either have populations that are shrinking, or (as in the UK) would be shrinking were it not for immigration.

 

[craner]

on another note, this fella deserves a mention

When I think about the Noughties, I think of Paris Hilton. When I think about the 20s, I think of Tucker Carlson.

When I think about the 2010s, I don't really know who I think of. Maybe Nick Clegg.