Finally: Now That's What I Call Vocal Grime

[Logan Sama]

And on that note, Scorcher - Chance Us(prod Wiley)/Terinator - Beef With T(prod Scorcher) and Mercston&Ghetto - Good Old Days(prod Rapid)/Mercston - Who's Mercs?(prod Rapid) 12"s are out on Friday in Uptown, Rhythm, Independance and UKRecordshop.com

Full colour label and only £5 per 12".

Also Scorcher - Simply The Best (jewel LP case with 4 page booklet and tray artwork) is still in stores.

 

[DJ Lioness]

one of the rinse djs yesterday or the day before i think mentioned a CD featuring grime vocalists - ie singers - and just a few MCs. anyone know more about this?

That would be The Voice of Grime volume 1 compiled and mainly produced by Scratcha DVA, which should be out next month.

www.myspace.com/voiceofgrime should have all the info.

 

[nomos]

thanks lioness

 

[tox]

Also Scorcher - Simply The Best (jewel LP case with 4 page booklet and tray artwork) is still in stores.

I believe this is exactly the kind of thing that petegunn's alluding too though. I pay money for my music, I don't care about the medium. Thats lucky, because the Scorcher mixtape, which cost me £7.99 the upper end of expense for a mixtape, has minimal artwork. "Simply The Best" written in Arial with blood dripping from it added in ms paint. This is not a good advert for quality packaging, even if the musical content is alright.

I've been thinking that one of the problems with Grime is the lack of illegal distribution. Blogs are always posting indie stuff, and it doesn't harm their sales. Infact indie labels clammer for mp3 blog attention. JT had SexyBack for download at 112kbps on his website, and all Lily Allen's singles were on her free mp3 mixtapes. In both these cases the mp3s were passed on and promoted by blogs (check The Hype Machine for evidence). None of the big blogs post Grime, and given it gets little radio play outside the capital there just isn't the exposure needed. Better that a potential fan hear a quality "leaked" mp3 than searching all around the net for horrible radio-rips. The prolific DC++ sharers are never gonna pay, but the rest of us might if we get a chance to hear it!

 

[Logan Sama]

Scorcher sat down with the graphic designer and actually picked out the look of the CD himself. That's exactly how he wanted it to look.

And while the lovely idea of giving away music for free would be fantastic in order to generate a fanbase, not all of grime's practisitioners can fall back in very affluent families to pay thier increasingly mounting studio and manufacturing costs in order to make sure their music is of the "quality" people like yourself appear to be demanding from it.

Imposing some sort of technical scale of merit which ignores artistic talent, on a form of music which is basically punk is ridiculous. Grime is low fi. It is dirty. It is raw. Aspiring to be a bright happy accessible product was it's downfall in 2005, and I will be damned if it is going to be that again in 2006/07. If you want well polished, "ironic" social witticisms and observations delivered from the safety net of Daddy's credit card, edgy Hoxton photoshoots and graphic design included, then Lily Alan is certain for you, still.

 

[mistersloane]

Scorcher sat down with the graphic designer and actually picked out the look of the CD himself. That's exactly how he wanted it to look.

Imposing some sort of technical scale of merit which ignores artistic talent, on a form of music which is basically punk is ridiculous.

I've been wondering when you's say something like that Logan. I was thinking about it today - that if there are no monies available for 'quality' production and distribution, then is there are a market for high quality produced limited releases? I mean really high quality, signed, limited editions. I can think of quite a few artists with limited but devoted fanbases who are prepared to pay a bit over the odds for a package that's been well thought out and interestingly designed - and the artists manage to live on that, they're not trust fund people. With your work, y'know, I'm talking hand-graffed covers, stuff like that. I'm not being funny it's just a thought. It's basically what happened to the punk people.

 

[bruno]

has minimal artwork. "Simply The Best" written in Arial with blood dripping from it added in ms paint.

hmm like suicide's first lp. that sounds excellent.

 

[Logan Sama]

I've been wondering when you's say something like that Logan. I was thinking about it today - that if there are no monies available for 'quality' production and distribution, then is there are a market for high quality produced limited releases? I mean really high quality, signed, limited editions. I can think of quite a few artists with limited but devoted fanbases who are prepared to pay a bit over the odds for a package that's been well thought out and interestingly designed - and the artists manage to live on that, they're not trust fund people. With your work, y'know, I'm talking hand-graffed covers, stuff like that. I'm not being funny it's just a thought. It's basically what happened to the punk people.

I think that is why JME does so well with Boy Better Know, he is basically graffing the covers up himself, he just uses photoshop to do it in. And they are appealling in a friendly quaint sort of way, rather than flashy or immediately impressive.

 

[tox]

Scorcher sat down with the graphic designer and actually picked out the look of the CD himself. That's exactly how he wanted it to look.

And while the lovely idea of giving away music for free would be fantastic in order to generate a fanbase, not all of grime's practisitioners can fall back in very affluent families to pay thier increasingly mounting studio and manufacturing costs in order to make sure their music is of the "quality" people like yourself appear to be demanding from it.

Imposing some sort of technical scale of merit which ignores artistic talent, on a form of music which is basically punk is ridiculous. Grime is low fi. It is dirty. It is raw. Aspiring to be a bright happy accessible product was it's downfall in 2005, and I will be damned if it is going to be that again in 2006/07. If you want well polished, "ironic" social witticisms and observations delivered from the safety net of Daddy's credit card, edgy Hoxton photoshoots and graphic design included, then Lily Alan is certain for you, still.

I tried to make clear I have no problems with the "quality" of Grime's musical content (when I used the word "quality" I was actually refering to the encoding quality of what flies around the net, mostly ripped by fans who can't get their hands on a Murkle Man vinyl or whatever y'know). Actually, neither do I particularly care about the presentation of the music's packaging. But by no account does Scorcher's mixtape visually stand out from any other Grime mixtape. The "4 page booklet" in my copy literally just says "M.O.V.E.M.E.N.T" in a stencil font, white on black. The point I was intending to make is that perhaps this is not the best example of artwork to present to someone who takes Petergunn's view point. There's nothing about the presentation that would make me feel sentimental about the physical record. (obviously no disrespect to Scorcher on that one - mixtapes growing on me).

The Lily Allen/mp3/JT/indie stuff was intended as a different point, more about how to get Grime out there. Obviously this is something you've thought about much more than I have, and worked hard on. Still, I would hope there's room for discussion here on Dissensus, so rather than prescribing Lily Allen to "people like" me, it would be preferable to have some kind of proper discourse...

---edit---

only just realised you run adamantium so i hope there's no offense caused, as none was meant. i can only imagine the hard-work that goes into putting together and distributing a mixtape!

 

[ripley]

And while the lovely idea of giving away music for free would be fantastic in order to generate a fanbase, not all of grime's practisitioners can fall back in very affluent families to pay thier increasingly mounting studio and manufacturing costs in order to make sure their music is of the "quality" people like yourself appear to be demanding from it..

If someone can't afford to sink some costs in promotional activity (as it seems to be for some indie music, as well as pop like JT etc) like releasing music for free, that doesn't mean that they are de facto going to make money from selling it, no matter how much they deserve it. It may suck that they can't afford it, but that doesn't mean that there's a better way to generate a fanbase. Generate a fanbase and make money (or make costs back in the short term) may in fact be mutually exclusive.

is the cost of studio time and manufacturing really growing? This I know nothing about. It does seem like grime does have that punk/raw edge which may or may not require expensive equipment. Do you feel the pressure on artists to raise production costs? Also, is cheaper production an indicator of poor quality Grime, in your opinion?

 

[Logan Sama]

The Economics of Grime:

In 2002-2004 a big tune could expect to sell between 2000 and 4000 units.

In 2006 a big tune ie: Gangsterz sells 1500 units. There are about 6 of these a year that sell on that level. For example Jon E Cash - Hoods Up or Youngdot - Bazooka Riddim. Numbers are down. Ergo the profit generated from one track is down too. Costs to record one tune remain effectively the same.

In 2006 however as vinyl isn't selling unless you have the one club smash, MCs and Crews are moving to CD format, as a herd mentality reaction to "ohnoes, teh vinyl is d34d!!1" cries. Mix CDs are sold in shops for the same price as vinyl. That means they are sold wholesale to the retailer at the same unit price. Around £3.50-£4. However, a mix CD costs half as much to manufacture than a vinyl (500 whites for £500 or 1000 JME style CDs for £550), you would assume, great! More money!. No, and here is why.

A mix CD contains around 20 tracks, these all need to have been recorded in a studio at a rate of around £20 an hour. Normally a tune takes 3 hours to finish including a rough mix down.

That's costs of £1200 as opposed to costs of £60 to record the contents of a vinyl release. Often the recording costs are nil if it is an instrumental release.

So while vinyl and CD sell the same units, and CDs are more consumer friendly and cheaper to manufacture, the actual recording costs of that volume of music when you are dealing with sales of under 2000 you find it hard to break even at all.

Do you see why it is vital that SOME form of proper infrastructure of distribution and sales is implemented in this scene, because it will reach a point when these kids genuinely cannot afford to carry on making it. I've hit that point as a DJ twice already as it is.

 

[Diggedy Derek]

That's a good tracklising, although somewhat old hat. Still, I like what Semtex does, so hopefully this will do well.

 

[the undisputed truth]

I just saw this and it explains a lot.

BET grimereport featuring whos who

 

[tryptych]

The Economics of Grime:

In 2002-2004 a big tune could expect to sell between 2000 and 4000 units.

In 2006 a big tune ie: Gangsterz sells 1500 units. There are about 6 of these a year that sell on that level. For example Jon E Cash - Hoods Up or Youngdot - Bazooka Riddim. Numbers are down. Ergo the profit generated from one track is down too. Costs to record one tune remain effectively the same.

In 2006 however as vinyl isn't selling unless you have the one club smash, MCs and Crews are moving to CD format, as a herd mentality reaction to "ohnoes, teh vinyl is d34d!!1" cries. Mix CDs are sold in shops for the same price as vinyl. That means they are sold wholesale to the retailer at the same unit price. Around £3.50-£4. However, a mix CD costs half as much to manufacture than a vinyl (500 whites for £500 or 1000 JME style CDs for £550), you would assume, great! More money!. No, and here is why.

A mix CD contains around 20 tracks, these all need to have been recorded in a studio at a rate of around £20 an hour. Normally a tune takes 3 hours to finish including a rough mix down.

That's costs of £1200 as opposed to costs of £60 to record the contents of a vinyl release. Often the recording costs are nil if it is an instrumental release.

So while vinyl and CD sell the same units, and CDs are more consumer friendly and cheaper to manufacture, the actual recording costs of that volume of music when you are dealing with sales of under 2000 you find it hard to break even at all.

Do you see why it is vital that SOME form of proper infrastructure of distribution and sales is implemented in this scene, because it will reach a point when these kids genuinely cannot afford to carry on making it. I've hit that point as a DJ twice already as it is.

Im confused - have to say I know very little about the world of grime, but if it is as Logan says a "punk" music, why are people spending money on expensive studio time? I thought all this stuff was being done on PCs at home with Fruityloops.

And isnt distributing mp3s a much more DIY thing overall; cutting out the middle men in labels etc, plus the electronic media-savvy young audience with there mp3 phones... isnt that what they should be aiming for?

 

[Logan Sama]

You need to go to a studio if you want to vocal something.

Either that or buy a microphone, pre-amp and compressor yourself.

Expensive either way you look at it.

People don't want shit sounding vocals. They don't want shit sounding anything. They always strive to mix down things as well as they can. Clarity is important to MCs and Producers.

 

[Poisonous Dart]

Simple answer

Im confused - have to say I know very little about the world of grime, but if it is as Logan says a "punk" music, why are people spending money on expensive studio time? I thought all this stuff was being done on PCs at home with Fruityloops.

And isnt distributing mp3s a much more DIY thing overall; cutting out the middle men in labels etc, plus the electronic media-savvy young audience with there mp3 phones... isnt that what they should be aiming for?

Regardless of the "feeling/DIY ethic/punkness" of any music form if it sound like shit when you HEAR the finished product and the packaging looks like it was made by a room full of 13 year olds on a PC...that song/CD is dead on arrival! If your songs sound like shit, then everything was for naught...Why record music if it doesn't make listeners WANT ot hear it...any songs I made that sounded like shit end up in the vault...never to be heard by any living person. One.

 

[Brokeman]

You need to go to a studio if you want to vocal something.

Either that or buy a microphone, pre-amp and compressor yourself.

Expensive either way you look at it.

People don't want shit sounding vocals. They don't want shit sounding anything. They always strive to mix down things as well as they can. Clarity is important to MCs and Producers.

but logan how does this make sense if grime used to be selling more units a few years back when tracks weren't as well recorded as they are today? my copy of tings in boots sounds terrible, as do any number of my favourite tracks from 2002-03 (other than the major-released stuff like kano & wiley, etc)

you may well be right that tastes have changed and people now want better quality but it seems from what you've said in your past two posts like it wasn't always the case that people needed a neumann mic and UREI preamps to cut a track.

just thinking aloud here...

 

[Logan Sama]

Unfortunately that is the way people think nowadays, and it has slowly over time become the accepted norm.

It is one of the unfortunate side effects of hip hop influencing these artists so much. they all want the Dr Dre mixdowns

 

[Logan Sama]

The only problem is putting out TV advertised projects with HUGE marketing budgets which could never ever dream of being recouped, thus further enforcing the idea that Grime isn't worth investing in.

 

[Jezmi]

Unfortunately that is the way people think nowadays, and it has slowly over time become the accepted norm.

It is one of the unfortunate side effects of hip hop influencing these artists so much. they all want the Dr Dre mixdowns

The music is made for digital formats now, not for analogue radio or booming rave boxes.....
The fizzing and crackeling of radio sets, with mc talking over tunes, only enhances the listening pleasure for me though. I guess it's an acquired taste sort, but I believe that Grime is best represented on a classic pirate radio set.
Listening to the sets, I've been able to find on the internet, made me buy mix cd's and records, it gave me the 'extra' incentive/appeal of buying the finished product.
Thing is that sometimes (like now) it's hard to find sets and also that most tunes that are played come out a year later or not at all. If that could be streamlined, making a periodic set available through internet with tunes about to be released, i think that would stimulate sales quite a bit. Like Fuck radio, but then consistent and more the format of a pirate radio set (build up through vocals, instrumentals and mcing). It would also be a better introduction to grime than a compilation like Semtex'.