jazz - any help appreciated

[Tentative Andy]

The Monk/Blakey and the Messengers collabarative album is a killer, if no-ones mentioned it yet.

Edit: and the Mulligan/Baker quartet for cool/West Coast jazz. Damn, I'd forgotten about half of this stuff and how great it is.

 

[loof]

oh i totally forgot about fat albert rotunda. i've got that, i liked it. one of a number of false starts i've had with jazz...

once again, thanks to everyone contributing.

i think slim's right that part of my problem with cool jazz is the sort of middle-aged cofee-tableyness of the image. it kind of pains me to admit it but it's really quite difficult to put that to one side.

it'd also be fair to say i've always struggled with stuff that's low tempo and, for want of a better term, relentlessly harmonious. i remember it taking really quite a long time to get into something like aphex twin's SAW 2 for example, and even now, it's not something i listen to very often, i really have to be in the mood. conversly, the first time i heard acid (the universal indicator mix cd when i was 18) i was utterly blown away. the universal indicator series, in spite of its in-yer-face wailing acid intensity, is actually quite subtle in terms of compound rhythms/time sigs, no doubt due in no small part to the idiosyncrasies of sequencing on a 303.

i'd say i come from a broad electronic background (old electro-y stuff, early detroity style techno, acid, hardcore, jungle, dubstep etc) with a little bit of noise (TG, coil, pan sonic).

people keep talking about sonic morphine but i think i'd be better off starting with sonic absinthe or sonic amphetamines when it comes to jazz ...

 

[Tentative Andy]

i found tentative andy's description of the hard bop era as jazz's classic-jungle interesting. jungle was the first thing that came into my mind when listening to the layered percussion in art blakey's orgy in rhythm, which is probably why i found it fairly easy to get into.

Yeah absolutely, hearing a full-on Amen rinse-out by someone like Remarc can often be eerily reminiscent to me of the licks that people like Max Roach, Blakey or Elvin Jones would play when they went into a big solo.

 

[slim jenkins]

Mmm...never done absinthe or amphetamines...:slanted:...go for Sun Ra's most Out There stuff...Ornette's 'Free Jazz'...er...Coltrane's late stuff...or...f*ck it, Last Exit! Noise ain't my speciality. As a Sonic Youth fan?

 

[empty mirror]

not usually my style to suggest that someone take drugs, but maybe you should revisit something like "in a silent way" or even "kind of blue" again next time you find yourself on painkillers or sedatives

chemistry informs music making as much as music listening
what's that spacemen 3 record called?

 

[Tentative Andy]

not usually my style to suggest that someone take drugs, but maybe you should revisit something like "in a silent way" or even "kind of blue" again next time you find yourself on painkillers or sedatives

Yup, and then whack on a long dubstep mix.

 

[Tentative Andy]

I'm always amazed just how lively the 40s and 50s bop-based stuff is, considering how many of the players had major heroin habits, plus the fact that some of them were heavily into booze and hash for the spells between hits. You'd expect the music to move at a permanent lethargic crawl!

 

[slim jenkins]

'Moose The Mooch'...named after Parker's dealer...not that his habit made him play better. Miles Davis's band with Coltrane were known as the 'Drink and Drugs' band...Coltrane nodding off during sessions...too much dark 'glamour' associated with all that. Mind you, as 'unhealthy' as their lifestyles were, they made better music than most who followed and could only imitate.

 

[craner]

I love Alice Coltrane - to a point.

I got tickets to see her at the Barbican late 2005, but she went and bloody died, didn't she?

That Universal Consciousness, World Galaxy, Lord of Lords trilogy is untouchable. The rest...ok, not mad on it.

Bit like Herbie: the Mwandishi, Crossings, Sextant trilogy is fantastic. The rest...meh. Apart from the disco/electro things, which I like.

I know this may sound mad to many of you, but I do dislike Bitches Brew, I think because I dislike the sound and attitude of John McLaughclin and Chick Corea, who're all over it. Ugly. I do dig Dark Margus.

 

[craner]

My mother, actually, is a jazz singer. She has her own quartet and sings all the old jazz standards at weddings and local jazz clubs and such. She doesn't like Dark Magus or Alice Coltrane, though.

 

[craner]

Fats Navarro is astonishing, by the way. It's a shame he was too fat and decadent to live for long (dead at 27!), but what he left behind is lovely and jaw-dropping. Very worth tracking down, say, this, 4 cds for a tenner, and packed with amazing things.

 

[craner]

Sidney Bechet obviously rocks. And Dexter Gordon has the lovely Blue Note Parisian late bar blues thing going on, which you'd have to be pulse-less and lacking soul not to love.

 

[empty mirror]

thought this would be a good place to share a photo of the arkestra at trumpeter tyrone hill's memorial service back in 2007
the arkestra entered the sanctuary playing a skronky "when the saints come marching in"
sad commentary on the state of jazz that tyrone hill was making more money playing trombone on the street corner than at a venue

 

[zhao]

rahsaan roland kirk's bright moments really cooks and it is pretty accessible, imo.

can someone give a basic run down of the different periods of his music? from what i've heard my favorites are:

1964 Roland Kirk - I Talk With The Spirits (Limelight LM 82008)
1965 Roland Kirk - Here Comes The Whistleman (Atlantic LP 3007)
1973 Rahsaan Roland Kirk - Prepare Thyself To Deal With A Miracle (Atlantic SD 1640)

all are more abstract, got that otherworldly gypsies-from-the-moon vibe, often on some concept/prog tip, songs forming different movements... as well as the classic rootsy swing.

the music on recordings like these are so unique, so alive, so sweet, enigmatic and unforgettable... but half or more of the Complete Mercury set is entirely unlistenable: the cheesiest gaudiest horrible commercial garbage. i imagine he had some bills to pay around the time those abominations were recorded?

 

[zhao]

Despite its emergence in the mainstream press it felt like a proper underground music fuelled by bands that simply could not sell-out or disappoint - a kind of purity of spirit and attitude that we picked up on.

i remember relating the Henry Grimes story, which i thought was just fucking insane, to a (pretty amazing) musician i used to be friends with in LA right after Grimes was "found", and my friend just shrugged, and pointed to the band members: Dave my basist? he played with so and so (big name i dont remember), and has been homeless during 3 separate time periods of his life; Steve the drummer? his book on percussion was published just recently, is crashing on my couch right now; i my self have slept in the park with the crack heads who knows how many times...

these guys really just spent every waking moment refining and improving their art, and the skills with which to execute it, without a thought to anything else... got to admire that.

and then there's the stories of Anthony Braxton playing chess for money in central park...

and to answer the original question, i didnt get into jazz until late 20s. and it was completely backwards: what drew me in was Evan Parker and Anthony Braxton. and from there to Steve Lacy, Dolphy, Ayler, Brotzmann, Trane's later records, and then Coleman, AEC, and then Monk, Mingus, and then Charlie Parker, Sydney Betchet, Louis Armstrong...

 

[zhao]

Loof, maybe you should do like i did, and work backwards.

i'd be better off starting with sonic absinthe

i love this man.

or sonic amphetamines

saw Paal Nilsen-Love play with Evan Parker 2 years ago. i was covered in goose-bumps, the weak hearted ran for cover, and every object within 50 meters of the stage was hovering above the ground. an elemental force, a natural disaster...

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[zhao]

oh and by the way, download links for everything i listed on the first page being amassed at my blog.

 

[muser]

don't know if these have been mentioned yet or not but definitely check...

&

The first album is one of the few albums I have where I always end up completley stopping whatever else I am doing and just listen. highly recommended!

 

[slim jenkins]

can someone give a basic run down of the different periods of his music? from what i've heard my favorites are:

1964 Roland Kirk - I Talk With The Spirits (Limelight LM 82008)
1965 Roland Kirk - Here Comes The Whistleman (Atlantic LP 3007)
1973 Rahsaan Roland Kirk - Prepare Thyself To Deal With A Miracle (Atlantic SD 1640)

all are more abstract, got that otherworldly gypsies-from-the-moon vibe, often on some concept/prog tip, songs forming different movements... as well as the classic rootsy swing.

the music on recordings like these are so unique, so alive, so sweet, enigmatic and unforgettable... but half or more of the Complete Mercury set is entirely unlistenable: the cheesiest gaudiest horrible commercial garbage. i imagine he had some bills to pay around the time those abominations were recorded?

Kirk's work is a minefield, as you suggest, of bonkers experimentation that isn't always successful, rather naff covers and amongst all that some blinding music. I recommend 'Rip Rig And Panic' (1965), if only for the title track and 'Slippery, Hippery, Flippery' for a great early example of integrating tape manipulation and electronics into jazz. That aside, try Mingus's 'Oh Yeah' album for 'Hog Callin' Blues' - Kirk on that is...blowing his brains out!

 

[empty mirror]

oh and by the way, download links for everything i listed on the first page being amassed at my blog.

cheers

i just checked out AEoC's A Jackson in Your House. good stuff. i have one record by them----Tutankhamun. skronky. everything i have heard from them sounds different.


today i picked up Hancock's Crossings on vinyl for a buck.