Hollywood Babylon

version

Well-known member

My gut feeling is the Nazi stuff was him playing around with the imagery rather than because he was a true believer or anything like that. Obviously it's not great either way and it was considered transgressive for a reason, but these conspiracy blogger / tweeter types seem to seize on crumbs to bolster the most outlandish interpretation possible.
 

DannyL

Wild Horses
My gut feeling is the Nazi stuff was him playing around with the imagery rather than because he was a true believer or anything like that. Obviously it's not great either way and it was considered transgressive for a reason, but these conspiracy blogger / tweeter types seem to seize on crumbs to bolster the most outlandish interpretation possible.
A lot of those conspiracy guys are really paranoid about occultism.
 

version

Well-known member
isnt reaching for "nonce" as an accusation a bit of a tired reflex?

Yeah, it is, but if you're hanging around with people like Page and Kinsey then some people are bound to ask questions.

That being said, chucking those sorts of allegations at a queer filmmaker, seemingly without much in the way of evidence and in the current climate in particular, is dangerous territory.
 

DannyL

Wild Horses
A lot of those conspiracy guys are really paranoid about occultism.
That Jimmy Falun Gong guys takes on occultism are just really mad. it's weird 'cos i know some of the people he's mentioned at a remove or two and its very much wrong end of the stick.
 

luka

Well-known member
horsely is on record as hating the gays. always banging on about it in his blog. plenty of gay nonces though so im defintely not saying hes not a nonce.
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
One of the reasons some people think he might have been a nonce is his involvement with Alfred Kinsey.
Wait, Kinsey was a paedo?

We gonna need a proper, definitive and comprehensive list of, say, everyone born before 1950 - all the people that never had sex with even one child. And it's gonna work the other way, to get on that list you have to provide cast iron proof that you never paedo'd at all, until that is done you are registered as a sex offender. It's the only sensible thing to do.
 

version

Well-known member
horsely is on record as hating the gays. always banging on about it in his blog. plenty of gay nonces though so im defintely not saying hes not a nonce.

Yeah, I mentioned that 16 Maps of Hell book Catalog talked about to a mate and he was like "Oh, I've heard of that guy. He's a prick. His Twitter's full of mental homophobic stuff," then showed me some tweet where he was ranting about anal sex being unnatural or something.
 

version

Well-known member
That Jimmy Falun Gong guys takes on occultism are just really mad. it's weird 'cos i know some of the people he's mentioned at a remove or two and its very much wrong end of the stick.

Now and then those guys come up with an interesting thread or book recommendation, but I can't be arsed with that corner of Twitter and podcasts at all. They're nutters. Always accusing each other of being "ops" and tracing someone's family tree until they find someone 'sus' they can use as a cudgel against them in whatever petty argument they're having that week.

So much of it is based on insinuation. They'll find that someone's dad was in the army or whatever and claim it proves they were working for the CIA or something. Tedious beyond belief.
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
My gut feeling is the Nazi stuff was him playing around with the imagery rather than because he was a true believer or anything like that. Obviously it's not great either way and it was considered transgressive for a reason, but these conspiracy blogger / tweeter types seem to seize on crumbs to bolster the most outlandish interpretation possible.
The thing is, the occultism stuff muddies the waters, some of these guys were maybe not natural paedos but they were happy to fuck a child when they playing dress up as wizards with the boys.
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
I don't know. What I've seen people bring up is that he did research on child sexuality and interviewed at least one person who claimed to have abused kids.
I notice this week that one of the tactics of the right to remove Sex Ed books from shelves is to throw around accusations of paedophilia. The argument goes something like; you want this book in the library, this book deals with sex, children will read this book. Children and sex appeared in the same sentence and you approve, therefore you are a paedo.
 

catalog

Well-known member
isnt reaching for "nonce" as an accusation a bit of a tired reflex?

Yeah, it is, but if you're hanging around with people like Page and Kinsey then some people are bound to ask questions.

That being said, chucking those sorts of allegations at a queer filmmaker, seemingly without much in the way of evidence and in the current climate in particular, is dangerous territory.

Yeah fair points. I can't find the book now but if it turns up I'll try and find the relevant bit. Probably not nonce. I should not have thrown that accusation in.

Re horsley and homophobia... I didn't know that but he's clearly a very traumatised person, possibly abused as a child?

A lot of what he says/writes is very far fetched and circumstantial.

But what I find attractive about him is this willingness to completely suspend his own disbelief and hallucinate a very unlikely narrative out of a load of random stuff.

He's going over a lot of well trod ground but in his own way.

There's a very feverish quality to the writing as a result where he says something, then interrogates it, does a sort of breaking of 4th wall thing, ends up somewhere else and then goes on more tangents.

I think he suits an occasional reading mode I have, which I used to do more, where I stay up into the small hours reading something and it really captures me, for hours.

Ironic really, as the central thesis of the kubrick book seems to be about this process of capture in the sense that he talks about films as invading your brain and so on.
 

DannyL

Wild Horses
Yeah fair points. I can't find the book now but if it turns up I'll try and find the relevant bit. Probably not nonce. I should not have thrown that accusation in.

Re horsley and homophobia... I didn't know that but he's clearly a very traumatised person, possibly abused as a child?

A lot of what he says/writes is very far fetched and circumstantial.

But what I find attractive about him is this willingness to completely suspend his own disbelief and hallucinate a very unlikely narrative out of a load of random stuff.

He's going over a lot of well trod ground but in his own way.

There's a very feverish quality to the writing as a result where he says something, then interrogates it, does a sort of breaking of 4th wall thing, ends up somewhere else and then goes on more tangents.

I think he suits an occasional reading mode I have, which I used to do more, where I stay up into the small hours reading something and it really captures me, for hours.

Ironic really, as the central thesis of the kubrick book seems to be about this process of capture in the sense that he talks about films as invading your brain and so on.
Horsely wrote a terrible book called The Matrix Warrior which is kinda like a self-help/magick book to help you fight your way out teh mattri8x, I shit you not. He is not someone I'd take as a credible source on those kind of accusations.
 

DannyL

Wild Horses
Now and then those guys come up with an interesting thread or book recommendation, but I can't be arsed with that corner of Twitter and podcasts at all. They're nutters. Always accusing each other of being "ops" and tracing someone's family tree until they find someone 'sus' they can use as a cudgel against them in whatever petty argument they're having that week.

So much of it is based on insinuation. They'll find that someone's dad was in the army or whatever and claim it proves they were working for the CIA or something. Tedious beyond belief.
I really liked the first 20 or so episodes of his podcast. They seemed pretty solid and well researched though he maybe he did overly rely on single sources. But I didn't get any "this dude is mad' red flags leaping out at me. The occult stuff is just wrong though, it takes the worst claims absolutely literally which you can't really do with writing that's at least part-allegory.

Last time I looked they were all trying to prove rap was a front for Satanism and that big crowd panic where a few people got crushed was a human sacrifice ritual.
 
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