The Feminine Perspective against the Manosphere

mixed_biscuits

mixed_biscuits

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It's far easier to tell men they by definition cannot do things that are other than male than create some kind of amalgam which fails fully to assimilate the feared behaviours

The bro: "I don't cry because it's womanly"
You: "If you cry, it's manly because you're a man who's crying"
 
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Well-known member
mixed_biscuits said:
It's far easier to tell men they by definition cannot do things that are other than male than create some kind of amalgam which fails fully to assimilate the feared behaviours

The bro: "I don't cry because it's womanly"
You: "If you cry, it's manly because you're a man who's crying"
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No see I'm saying something more like "if you cry, it's womanly, and if that makes you manly, it's because you have the manly courage to be womanly."
 
mixed_biscuits

mixed_biscuits

_________________________
Schoolboy 1 picks pink chair
Schoolboy 2: "Ugh, only girls pick pink chairs"
Schoolboy 1: "I am a boy and have picked a pink chair so your assertion is incorrect"
 
mixed_biscuits

mixed_biscuits

_________________________
malelesbian said:
No see I'm saying something more like "if you cry, it's womanly, and if that makes you manly, it's because you have the manly courage to be womanly."
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That's already quite a mouthful, even before one tries to work out to what extent each of those references to sex/gender is meant to be socially constructed
 
Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
malelesbian said:
Society makes them feminine values. Communities accept certain qualities as feminine.

First off, if all "feminine" means to you is "of pertaining to, possessed or produced by women", then you are an essentialist. Full stop. Only essentialist views assert a necessary connection between women and femininity.

Second, as I have said many times before, "feminine" just means non-phallic, in other words, related to the other person rather than one's own selfish desires


All theories of gender say that some behaviors are masculine and some feminine. This is unavoidable. Again, to say that anti-essentialism forbids classifying any behaviors as gendered is just to deny the existence of gender.

Also, both femininity and masculinity involve good and bad qualities. The problem is that the good feminine qualities are underrepresented in our society.
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This is what Wiktionary gives as the first four definitions of 'feminine':

Of or pertaining to the female gender; womanly.

Of or pertaining to the female sex; biologically female, not male.

Belonging to females; typically used by females.
Mary, Elizabeth, and Edith are feminine names.

Having the qualities stereotypically associated with women: nurturing, not aggressive. quotations
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mixed_biscuits said:
Well then men could just implement your project by just calling their behaviours 'feminine'
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Maybe so, but has any community accepted their classification of their behaviors as feminine? Not actually, so it's a moot point.
Mr. Tea said:
This is what Wiktionary gives as the first four definitions of 'feminine':
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Yes, well as we've already seen, the dictionary definition of 'sissy' is just a feminine man, but no one but me accepts that definition. Why should I accept an essentialist definition of femininity? The point I'm making is that gendered qualities are detachable from sexed bodies, hence I am an anti-essentialist. Any person can bear feminine qualities regardless of their body type. If individuals living in male bodies must act masculine, that is essentialism.
 
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mixed_biscuits said:
@malelesbian you're being essentialist in referring to 'male bodies' btw
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No, I allow for a changing definition of male bodies. Anti-essentialism doesn't mean we can't identify sexual differences in the anatomy. It just means that biological interpretations of the body are just that, one more way of interpreting the body.
 
Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
malelesbian said:
Maybe so, but has any community accepted their classification of their behaviors as feminine? Not actually, so it's a moot point.

Yes, well as we've already seen, the dictionary definition of 'sissy' is just a feminine man, but no one but me accepts that definition. Why should I accept an essentialist definition of femininity? The point I'm making is that gendered qualities are detachable from sexed bodies, hence I am an anti-essentialist. Any person can bear feminine qualities regardless of their body type. If individuals living in male bodies must act masculine, that is essentialism.
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If you want to abstract the terms 'masculine' and 'feminine' from actual men and actual women, but still want to signify things you consider 'bad' and 'good' respectively, the alternative is just to use the words 'bad' and 'good.'
 
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Well-known member
Mr. Tea said:
If you want to abstract the terms 'masculine' and 'feminine' from actual men and actual women, but still want to signify things you consider 'bad' and 'good' respectively, the alternative is just to use the words 'bad' and 'good.'
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But see, I've repeatedly maintained that both feminine and masculine qualities can be bad and good. It's just a bad masculine quality to hide the good feminine qualities. But there are bad feminine qualities and good masculine qualities too.
 
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