The Scapegoat
- Thread starter version
- Start date
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
I've lost count of the accusations and counter-accusations of strawmanism at this point, but anyway: who is it that's assuming "vaccination prevents the spread"? And who is it that's propagating this idea? Everything I've seen in the media about this has almost been at pains to point out that vaccination reduces your chances of catching this or that variant by however many percent. It's not saying "Get vaxxed, become invulnerable."
Again, the fact of vaccines not being 100% effective on an individual level totally ignores the fact that vaccines are not intended to work only the individual, and that some people have a good medical reason for not being vaccinated.
version
Well-known member
I've heard antibacterial sprays and the like which claim to kill "99.9% of bacteria" may weaken our immune systems as we end up being exposed to fewer things which keep them hardened.
There seems to be a general sense of panic whenever we struggle to completely prevent or control things. You can see it with Covid, Afghanistan, the response to various political outcomes. It's like Peter Thiel pumping more and more money into preventing his own death. If we just believe and keep throwing resources at things then we never have to consider or plan for a possibility other than total success.
version
Well-known member
Well, that's the only time I've ever used the term in this discussion as I make a point of not using it, so you can note down a single use of "strawman" from me.
The people assuming vaccination prevents the spread are the people placing the blame for the ongoing situation at the feet of the unvaccinated and the unvaccinated only, people like the writer of that Salon article I posted the headline from and members of the public (or perhaps bots? - which raises a whole different issue) on social media.
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
Not that those are necessarily directly comparable to a respiratory virus, but clearly there have been plenty of diseases which, at least in many countries, have been totally eradicated.
version
Well-known member
You keep saying that as though I'm arguing things can never be eradicated when what I'm saying is we have to consider the possibility that not everything can be eradicated.
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
Sounded a lot like you were saying it was definitely impossible and therefore shouldn't even be attempted.
version
Well-known member
I'm arguing we might have to accept we can't eradicate it after almost two years and God knows how much money attempting to. I wasn't arguing this before that attempt.
Leo
Well-known member
and I guess what I'm saying is those people are wrong, they've always been wrong, and their incorrect views aren't the criteria to judge success.
Leo
Well-known member
and I think most sensible people do.
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
Me and versh get on fine even when we disagree about something, because we are mature grown-ups.
Clinamenic
Binary & Tweed
I wonder how he would go about this. Probably make a private conversation with everyone but Tea. Seems more efficient than sending out individual messages to everyone but Tea.