Terrorism/Media

[craner]

i dont think this is a bad thing

I know you don't, because that precisely describes you.

 

[craner]

yes, he thinks the Bush administration conspired to kill thousands of American citizens. most people in the world today beleive this.

Is that what you believe Version?

 

[luka]

i think its the best way to be.

 

[craner]

I don't. Not every story deserves the same treatment. Nor, in reality, do you actually think or behave in that way, because you're not really that narrow-minded or ignorant or stupid.

 

[version]

So, what does that mean? That you think there may be something to this whole 9/11 was an inside job thing, but you don't really want to pin your name to it? Or that you think that parts of 9/11 were an inside job, but other parts were Al-Qaeda?

I think I don't know enough about it to completely dismiss the idea that someone in the US may have known it was going to happen or may have benefited from it in some way.

My general view of conspiracy theories is stuff like the hologram thing is bullshit, but that I've heard enough about things like Northwoods, MKUltra, various coups and so on that I can't ever completely trust what I'm told and struggle to take a solid position.

 

[craner]

I think I don't know enough about it to completely dismiss the idea that someone in the US may have known it was going to happen or may have benefited from it in some way.

So you think that Al-Qaeda did it, but you suspect that somebody in the government or CIA knew about it and let it go ahead in order to create the conditions for an invasion of Afghanistan and to pass something like the Patriot Act? Something like that?

 

[version]

I believe the general outline of the official story, but wouldn't claim to know what definitely happened when it comes to details.

 

[luka]

So you think that Al-Qaeda did it, but you suspect that somebody in the government or CIA knew about it and let it go ahead in order to create the conditions for an invasion of Afghanistan and to pass something like the Patriot Act? Something like that?

thats what 99% of the population beleive

 

[craner]

I believe the general outline of the official story, but wouldn't claim to know what definitely happened when it comes to details.

I'm just trying to get my head around your thinking.

 

[version]

So you think that Al-Qaeda did it, but you suspect that somebody in the government or CIA knew about it and let it go ahead in order to create the conditions for an invasion of Afghanistan and to pass something like the Patriot Act? Something like that?

I think it's a possibility, but I also think it's possible that it was just incompetence on the part of the US or that they were genuinely caught by surprise.

 

[craner]

I think it's a possibility, but I also think it's possible that it was just incompetence on the part of the US or that they were genuinely caught by surprise.

Which do you think is the more plausible possibility?

 

[luka]

 

[craner]

thats what 99% of the population beleive

99% of the social media accounts you monitor

 

[version]

Which do you think is the more plausible possibility?

I'm leaning towards incompetence atm, or at least some sort of failing. That being said, we've often heard reports that the security services are aware of various plots underway at any given time and 9/11 was a pretty big plot, so it's weird to think they had no idea it was coming.

 

[Clinamenic]

I think I don't know enough about it to completely dismiss the idea that someone in the US may have known it was going to happen or may have benefited from it in some way.

My general view of conspiracy theories is stuff like the hologram thing is bullshit, but that I've heard enough about things like Northwoods, MKUltra, various coups and so on that I can't ever completely trust what I'm told and struggle to take a solid position.

I'm not familiar enough with these classic cases, but as I understand national defense intelligence, there needs to be secrecy, things not revealed to the public, for doing so would jeopardize the operation.

So this makes trust a tricky issue. Obviously we won't get the full story, nor do I think we should, but can trust be established even given this margin of secrecy? Can we trust the bodies in the intelligence community to not routinely abuse their discretionary secrecy?

I'm inclined to trust them, largely because I agree that they shouldn't tell us everything, even some of the things that directly impact our safety and ways of life.

 

[luka]

I'm leaning towards incompetence atm, or at least some sort of failing. That being said, we've often heard reports that the security services are aware of various plots underway at any given time and 9/11 was a pretty big plot, so it's weird to think they had no idea it was coming.

dont let him browbeat you into submission.

 

[luka]

hes just trying to give you flashbacks to your dad and school headmasters and HR representatives. its MK Ultra tactics

 

[craner]

dont let him browbeat you into submission.

I win!

 

[Clinamenic]

I'm leaning towards incompetence atm, or at least some sort of failing. That being said, we've often heard reports that the security services are aware of various plots underway at any given time and 9/11 was a pretty big plot, so it's weird to think they had no idea it was coming.

I tend to think this way too, and I;ve heard this voiced by figures in the intelligence community (I can try to track down who and what, if needed), namely that there was a disorganized [and unintegrated] state of intelligence gathering/reporting/sharing leading up to 9/11, and as I understand it part of DHS's mandate was to help facilitate intelligence pertaining to, well, homeland security.

edit: bracketed text

 

[luka]

just tell him, yeah, i think Bush knocked down the towers. whats the problem?