Dubstep

[Shonx]

although fun to rave to when you're off your head, and surely that's nothing to be sniffed at from the point of view of a believer in the importance of rave?) here... I often think I'm being too hard on the wobbly stuff and missing its essential qualities as music to rave to, 'a bit of fun' etc... and then I listen to it

I've never really thought of dubstep as particularly good dance music (well at the beginning maybe), always thought that a lot of rave was mostly about taking pills and dancing all night, and dubstep lacks the energy, doesn't groove or takes itself too seriously to be included in that canon - nightwise it reminds me more of a hip hop gig, more drinking, weed and nodding really. The only time I've heard that sound recently and enjoyed it was in a Sinden set where it just seemed to basically be a bit of a break before the more upbeat tunes came on.

 

[faustus]

on his new tempa ep which isn't official yet but coming soon

 

[mms]

it's funny how people keep on mentioning kuduro when what they mean is buraka sound system - who incidentally got signed to fabric record label.

wobble stuff is all shouty isn't it

 

[Slothrop]

I've never really thought of dubstep as particularly good dance music (well at the beginning maybe), always thought that a lot of rave was mostly about taking pills and dancing all night, and dubstep lacks the energy, doesn't groove or takes itself too seriously to be included in that canon

Speak for yourself, I nearly damaged my kneecap busting an over ambitious move to a Geiom set last year...

 

[sodiumnightlife]

Or am I just paying attention to the bits I'm interested in and making a generalised statement about an entire continent?

Touche sir! Substitue europe with european house community or whatever you want to call it.

Shonx, come on, dubstep not dancing music? This sounds a little like retrospectice distacing from the genre. Fair enough, its not as obviously dancy as jungle or 2-step or house, but the very un-obvious nature of it, the new way in which its rhythms made you dance was the thing that made me fall in love with it in the first place.

 

[benjybars]

I've never really thought of dubstep as particularly good dance music

haha.. Shonx your relentless negativity towards dubstep is jokes!

i've had more fun skanking out at grime/dubstep nights than pretty much any other music (apart from the status quo cover band that played at my grandad's party when i was 9)

 

[Shonx]

Shonx, come on, dubstep not dancing music? This sounds a little like retrospectice distacing from the genre. Fair enough, its not as obviously dancy as jungle or 2-step or house, but the very un-obvious nature of it, the new way in which its rhythms made you dance was the thing that made me fall in love with it in the first place.

I dunno, felt that way with the earlier shit, never really felt it with much post 2005 to be honest. Lovin the description of non-obviously dancey though - so funkless maybe?

I was always distancing myself from that end of stuff, if I have to imagine where a groove should be, tune isn't working basically.

 

[sodiumnightlife]

I dunno, felt that way with the earlier shit, never really felt it with much post 2005 to be honest. Lovin the description of non-obviously dancey though - so funkless maybe?

I was always distancing myself from that end of stuff, if I have to imagine where a groove should be, tune isn't working basically.

Not what I meant at all. Jungle was funky without being obvious and so was the best end of dubstep.

 

[Shonx]

Jungle > dubstep, at least dance wise. Jungle to me was so obviously danceable I couldn't believe people couldn't hear it

 

[sodiumnightlife]

Fair enough, its all opinions i guess but I always think dubstep is insanely danceable, more than you would think on first listen.

 

[Shonx]

I've given it a fair old chance, it's just my opinion. Never had one of those moments with it where just been itching to get on the floor which is generally a big indicator with me.

 

[Sick Boy]

Fair enough, its all opinions i guess but I always think dubstep is insanely danceable, more than you would think on first listen.

I agree, though I remember when I was first exposed to it, listening to Plasticman play all these half-step grime tunes, I had no idea how it could be club music. It just sounded so un-danceable. It's like Kode 9 says though: it functions as open-ended dance music with the dancer filling in, as they see fit, the necessary extra beats themselves during the wide open spaces in the music. It certainly takes a few times before that clicks.

 

[Shonx]

It's like Kode 9 says though: it functions as open-ended dance music with the dancer filling in, as they see fit, the necessary extra beats themselves during the wide open spaces in the music. It certainly takes a few times before that clicks.

Yeah, I can remember going out to minimal techno nights and adding the fucking melody too

Some dubstep tunes work well like that, mostly don't to my mind though.

 

[faustus]

i really like the LD mix from mary anne hobbs last week.

Cluekid Vs L.D. – ‘The Intro’ (Ringo Records)
Benga Vs L.D. – ‘Yes Yes’ (Ringo Records)
L.D. – ‘Green Ranger’ (2nd Drop Records)
Kode 9 Vs L.D. – ‘Bad’ (Hyperdub)
Benga Vs L.D. – ‘3 Phase’ (Ringo Records)
Cluekid Vs L.D. – ‘Not Going 2 Cry’ (Bullfrog Beats)
L.D. – ‘Wood Block’ (Dubplate)
L.D. – ‘Oh Yeah’ (Dubplate)
L.D. – ‘Do You Mind’ (Dubplate)
L.D. – ‘Piece In Our Culture’ (Dub Police)

 

[mos dan]

I often think I'm being too hard on the wobbly stuff and missing its essential qualities as music to rave to, 'a bit of fun' etc... and then I listen to it

shd point out that (a) this debate is kind of accidentally going on on lower end spasm, and (b) i quoted you in the comments, thanks corps.
http://dot-alt.blogspot.com/2008/10/hessle-audio-going-on-deep.html

 

[Ory]

it's all about how it's executed..

bait: http://www.soundsoftheuniverse.com/releases/?id=13193

genius: http://www.planet-mu.com/discography/ZIQ223

 

[Bang Diddley]

shd point out that (a) this debate is kind of accidentally going on on lower end spasm, and (b) i quoted you in the comments, thanks corps.
http://dot-alt.blogspot.com/2008/10/hessle-audio-going-on-deep.html

Yes, interestingly the harder, stronger faster sounds didn't have much longevity in techno or dnb, I would guess the same will be true in dubstep and as the listening demographic gets older and wants more than a bass drop or a bad ass kick drum. I've always liked the space in dubstep where your mind can wander and draw it own conclusions, legs can dance their own steps rather than be forced by the metronome of the drum.

So im with the deeper dubstep sounds. There's nothing wrong with a huge wobble here and there. But a wobble, wheel and next wobble with more adrenaline gets a bit much for my old brain cells : )

 

[sodiumnightlife]

new ikonika on hyperdub is awesome. thought please was good but a bit too rigid, but this is just overflowing with aweomse little side melodies and rhytmic trickeries. I also like it that her and zomby aren't scared of half step.

 

[Sick Boy]

shd point out that (a) this debate is kind of accidentally going on on lower end spasm, and (b) i quoted you in the comments, thanks corps.
http://dot-alt.blogspot.com/2008/10/hessle-audio-going-on-deep.html

I think it's interesting how in the comments section some man points out that whereas Pangaea might be good, it wouldn't tear the roof off a club and then Ben replies saying that he actually thinks of a lot of the tunes he plays as club tracks.

I agree! For me, a tune like Rustie's 'Zig Zag' for instance, (if you haven't heard this yet, do yourself a favour) while being totally fucked up, has as much potential to get a dancefloor moving as, say, Coki's 'Spongebob'. Also, anyone who says any different can't have seen Kode 9 or Mala spin, because whenever I have the dancefloor has been everything but dead.

It's simply knee-jerk anti-snobbism to say that the most effective dance music is retarded. Try telling that to the techno community and they'd have a fucking heart attack.

 

[Slothrop]

I think it's interesting how in the comments section some man points out that whereas Pangaea might be good, it wouldn't tear the roof off a club and then Ben replies saying that he actually thinks of a lot of the tunes he plays as club tracks.

I agree! For me, a tune like Rustie's 'Zig Zag' for instance, (if you haven't heard this yet, do yourself a favour) while being totally fucked up, has as much potential to get a dancefloor moving as, say, Coki's 'Spongebob'. Also, anyone who says any different can't have seen Kode 9 or Mala spin, because whenever I have the dancefloor has been everything but dead.

It's simply knee-jerk anti-snobbism to say that the most effective dance music is retarded. Try telling that to the techno community and they'd have a fucking heart attack.

Yeah, what really fucks me off is that I actually want diverse, exciting, forwarding thinking music to dance to, because one of the things that gets me most hyper when I'm dancing is hearing something really unexpected but amazing. (And yeah, like people say, sometimes wall to wall 'deepness' can be as predictable and limited as wall to wall bangers.) Whereas both 'sides' to some extent have been complicit in coding halfstep wobble as "rave bangers" and Pangaea / Peverelist / Martyn as sophisticated chin strokery that you can't really dance to.

I think what got me really excited on hearing that series of Mary Ann Hobbs shows - Generation Dub, Hyperdub Showcase, Cotti & Cluekid Vs Heny G & Jay 5ive - was that it cast light on a lot of points inbetween the extremes and undermined the idea of some sort of binary opposition.