Tales from the scene

IdleRich

IdleRich
@Clinamenic what about you do you have good blockchain popcorn?

@IdleRich tell us about the most degenerate thing that ever happened in the fat white scene
I dunno about degenerate but I think the funniest was maybe the evening filled with incident but which culminated in a certain person trying to avoid paying his bar bill by stealing his card from behind the bar and legging it... but he got chased and caught by the bouncers whereupon he pretended to have a fit - so well that an ambulance was called. He was carried inside on a stretcher but as they went to strap him down he jumped up, pushed the medics aside and disappeared into the night...
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
One person used to rent space in his arsehole when they needed to fly and take b with them. You paid him by the bag. Loads of arguments ensued as they kept wanting to get high on the plane etc, asking him to make frequent, irritating withdrawals.
 

version

Well-known member
i'm also curious about the blogging thing that dissensus apparently sprung out of. i've seen fragments of those stories on here. it sounds like it would have been a nice thing to be a part of, particularly as a lot of people were writing and publishing stuff. the zero books genesis is intriguing too.

Sydney Review of Books did a series on the "blogosphere" a while back that Blissblog and Owen Hatherley took part in.

Part 1.
Part 2.
Part 3.
 

shakahislop

Well-known member
did anyone else read that blog that was supposedly a polish hospitality worker talking about her experiences in a hotel? that was around for a bit. i met the person wrote that years later, the whole thing was made up
 

shakahislop

Well-known member
Carl Neville: I’ll just take us slightly back to the going overground/counterculture stuff, if I may. Firstly, the counterculture — if we are thinking of say 60s through to mid-80s — was based in some ways on the post-WW2 compact: full employment, generous (by historic standards) welfare payments, cheap housing, generally rising living standards; under those circumstances people have the time and energy to be involved in experimental art and civil rights and anti-war movements. None of those conditions really apply anymore in the post-(post-?) Fordist world.

I caught the tail end of this in the mid-80s and early 90s. We had a friend of a friend, for instance, who had toured supporting Killing Joke (a big deal in our eyes) whose band had just sat on the dole for years practicing to get good. I don’t remember feeling I was going to get ripped off or kicked out by a landlord, i.e. that my accommodation was precarious in any way really, until I came back to London in 2013. I was in Leeds mostly at the time and squats were common both as living and rehearsal spaces. Libraries were a great source of books and records and later videos. There were physical, small scale book, record and video stores (and early computer game stores) with their respective magi from whom you could receive wisdom etc, hang out in. There was something like a Universal Basic Income/services already available: you had the hospital, the library, higher education/courses, much, much less stringent criteria for receiving dole/housing benefit and much greater help.

As I was growing up and obviously work shy and unambitious in material terms but y’know, with a thirst for beauty and all that, the existence of these things was a massive psychological support: it doesn’t matter really, any of it, I can just go on the dole…. The album which absolutely best captures this sort of wonderland of (relative) ease and time to experiment, the alternate dimension that ran alongside the everyday, mundane working world is probably that Blue Orchids album, The Greatest Hit.


to what extent do we all believe in this? it seems like a piece of social analysis that comes up again and again now, with jarvis cocker being probably the most influential proponent of it. it's before my time. definitely by the early 10s being able to have the arty life seemed impossible without someone else bankrolling you (not that i ever seriously tried, it just looked impossible or at least really difficult to me). but i never know how much of this is cope for not ever having had the balls to do it. one other explanation is that a different kind of person emerged in subsequent decades, people who would rather do something else than piss around making post-punk in squats
 

sus

Moderator
that jeremy gilbert podcast i keep going on about refers to mancuso about five times an episode. i think some form of the loft is still going isn't it?

it was this article i was talking about. absolutely gross. sticks in the mind as the best example of the US arty scene fantasy (that is apparently different to what linebugh is getting at in this thread)

You read Crumps dispatches yeah?
 

shakahislop

Well-known member
The essay ‘London After the Rave’ on Burial’s debut album was a memorable moment — a sensation of being floored with awe, combined with a feeling of ‘damn, I wish I had thought of that’. Which relates to the earlier point about the blog scene being a space of competition as well as collaboration/camaraderie. Mark’s post was a massive preemptive strike that nailed the album and artist in an utterly and breathtakingly definitive way, such that no one has ever been able to get around it (although Adam Harper on Rouge’s Foam made a valiant attempt at a different reading).

that's something blissblogger said six years ago in the article version linked to. it's amazing how frequently some of the things that k punk said in those reviews, and pretended burial said in the interviews in the wire, get repeated by people who never read them. there are hints in the tunes and artwork themselves obviously but i think the interpretive writing around those burial albums is one of the reasons they became such a thing
 

version

Well-known member
lets do this properly. i haven't read this for years but i keep telling people i'm sure it was made up by k punk or someone. the responses line up so well with his concerns.


Yeah, the M R James bit sounds like Mark talking to himself. It's too perfect a shared point of reference.

Burial: On the South Bank last year, I was walking along, and I found a book of M R James ghost stories. I bunked that day off from my day job and I got this book, and now I’m well into M R James ghost stories.

Wire: You’re joking, really?


Maybe Mark, Burial and Kode9 put their heads together and decided to invent "Burial".
 

shakahislop

Well-known member
Carl Neville: I’ll just take us slightly back to the going overground/counterculture stuff, if I may. Firstly, the counterculture — if we are thinking of say 60s through to mid-80s — was based in some ways on the post-WW2 compact: full employment, generous (by historic standards) welfare payments, cheap housing, generally rising living standards; under those circumstances people have the time and energy to be involved in experimental art and civil rights and anti-war movements. None of those conditions really apply anymore in the post-(post-?) Fordist world.

I caught the tail end of this in the mid-80s and early 90s. We had a friend of a friend, for instance, who had toured supporting Killing Joke (a big deal in our eyes) whose band had just sat on the dole for years practicing to get good. I don’t remember feeling I was going to get ripped off or kicked out by a landlord, i.e. that my accommodation was precarious in any way really, until I came back to London in 2013. I was in Leeds mostly at the time and squats were common both as living and rehearsal spaces. Libraries were a great source of books and records and later videos. There were physical, small scale book, record and video stores (and early computer game stores) with their respective magi from whom you could receive wisdom etc, hang out in. There was something like a Universal Basic Income/services already available: you had the hospital, the library, higher education/courses, much, much less stringent criteria for receiving dole/housing benefit and much greater help.

As I was growing up and obviously work shy and unambitious in material terms but y’know, with a thirst for beauty and all that, the existence of these things was a massive psychological support: it doesn’t matter really, any of it, I can just go on the dole…. The album which absolutely best captures this sort of wonderland of (relative) ease and time to experiment, the alternate dimension that ran alongside the everyday, mundane working world is probably that Blue Orchids album, The Greatest Hit.


to what extent do we all believe in this? it seems like a piece of social analysis that comes up again and again now, with jarvis cocker being probably the most influential proponent of it. it's before my time. definitely by the early 10s being able to have the arty life seemed impossible without someone else bankrolling you (not that i ever seriously tried, it just looked impossible or at least really difficult to me). but i never know how much of this is cope for not ever having had the balls to do it. one other explanation is that a different kind of person emerged in subsequent decades, people who would rather do something else than piss around making post-punk in squats

All of which meant that my life at that point revolved around minimum-wage shift work and disconsolate drinking with work colleagues, many of whom were also musicians, artists, actors, playwrights, poets — people who, thirty or forty years earlier, might have been able to subsist on the dole and/or living in squats with the time, space, and energy to work creatively; or who, in the 2010s, with more middle-class backgrounds and better connections, might have become one of the (fairly insufferable) cultural workers and self-facilitating media nodes that Dalston was full of. I mention this because, ten years later, there’s now a general recognition of how neoliberalism has materially reshaped the cultural industries and the opportunities available to working-class creatives, but there was certainly an incompletely articulated recognition of this at the time — a sense that former options and alternatives had been closed off. Occasionally, since this was so rarely acknowledged openly, you began to wonder if these options and alternatives had ever existed at all, if the cultural networks and political possibilities of the 1970s were merely some desperate fever dream you’d made up on the bus back to your bedsit.

someone called rhiann jones, who i now realize i read quite a lot of at the time
 

version

Well-known member
One improvement nowadays seems to be that basically anyone can put stuff online and potentially reach an audience. There are probably people with no money or connections who managed to make it just sticking things on YouTube or social media from their bedroom.
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
All of which meant that my life at that point revolved around minimum-wage shift work and disconsolate drinking with work colleagues, many of whom were also musicians, artists, actors, playwrights, poets — people who, thirty or forty years earlier, might have been able to subsist on the dole and/or living in squats with the time, space, and energy to work creatively; or who, in the 2010s, with more middle-class backgrounds and better connections, might have become one of the (fairly insufferable) cultural workers and self-facilitating media nodes that Dalston was full of. I mention this because, ten years later, there’s now a general recognition of how neoliberalism has materially reshaped the cultural industries and the opportunities available to working-class creatives, but there was certainly an incompletely articulated recognition of this at the time — a sense that former options and alternatives had been closed off. Occasionally, since this was so rarely acknowledged openly, you began to wonder if these options and alternatives had ever existed at all, if the cultural networks and political possibilities of the 1970s were merely some desperate fever dream you’d made up on the bus back to your bedsit.

someone called rhiann jones, who i now realize i read quite a lot of at the time

there's a lot I could say about this but the counter-culture (or to be more precise, the welfare state) was largely funded off the backs of immigrants from britain's ex-colonies and those states which were caught up in inter-war anglo-french imperialist territorial rivalries.
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
Yeah, the M R James bit sounds like Mark talking to himself. It's too perfect a shared point of reference.

Burial: On the South Bank last year, I was walking along, and I found a book of M R James ghost stories. I bunked that day off from my day job and I got this book, and now I’m well into M R James ghost stories.

Wire: You’re joking, really?


Maybe Mark, Burial and Kode9 put their heads together and decided to invent "Burial".

That's not a maybe, burial is kode nine. even if he is some guy called William, all his feed is kode nine. CCRU and deleuze. The cultural crit stuff is really adolescently bourgeois, but it produced some great music so I won't complain too much.
 
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