Brexit Day

IdleRich

IdleRich

IdleRich
I think that was pretty much the opposite of my argument in fact.
Anyway, re the UK... I would be sad if the UK broke up cos I think of myself as from the UK rather than English. I have one grandparent from England, one from Scotland, one from Wales and the other one is, if not strictly Irish, certainly of Irish descent and that's the one whose surname I have and it's a name that's usually Irish. But that is just sentimentality really and I completely understand why Scotland etc want to leave the UK and probably should.
 
IdleRich

IdleRich

IdleRich
These are fair enough points Rich, and clearly there will be problems with any institution. The EU seems very hard to reform though?
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I assume that anything of that kind of size is very hard to reform. I don't know who is really trying to reform it at the moment though so it's hard to say for sure.
But like I say, there are two points here a) I think that on balance the EU is a good thing b) but my main point is that good or bad it's better to be in it than out fighting against it.
 
Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
thirdform said:
you and tea's argument is that bad shit happens. you do realise how unpersuasive this is when in or out the EU, the DWP for instance are absolute filth?
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Don't put words in my mouth. Bad shit happens if people either let it happen or actively cause it to happen. Unless the government can pull together a bunch of trade deals in the next eleven months after failing to do so in three and a half years, it's going to fuck the economy far worse than the 2008-09 crash did. And the consequences of that are obviously going to be felt the hardest by those who are already the worst off.

The trouble with asking "How much worse can things get?" is that you might just be about to find out.
 
T

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
IdleRich said:
I think that was pretty much the opposite of my argument in fact.
Anyway, re the UK... I would be sad if the UK broke up cos I think of myself as from the UK rather than English. I have one grandparent from England, one from Scotland, one from Wales and the other one is, if not strictly Irish, certainly of Irish descent and that's the one whose surname I have and it's a name that's usually Irish. But that is just sentimentality really and I completely understand why Scotland etc want to leave the UK and probably should.
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political melancholy is the root of fascism. not even joking btw.
 
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thirdform

pass the sick bucket
Mr. Tea said:
Don't put words in my mouth. Bad shit happens if people either let it happen or actively cause it to happen. Unless the government can pull together a bunch of trade deals in the next eleven months after failing to do so in three and a half years, it's going to fuck the economy far worse than the 2008-09 crash did. And the consequences of that are obviously going to be felt the hardest by those who are already the worst off.

The trouble with asking "How much worse can things get?" is that you might just be about to find out.
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nah. you're just mendacious. you just want other people to do politics for you and then when noone can be fucked to stick up for your kind (including the conservatives you so amply castigate even though they represent your class interests in the longterm) you cry foul as if absolving yourselves as the sensible pragmatic ones. what have you actually done to stop brexit? Fuck all apart from whinging.

Noone likes an ever so concerned Robin Hood woke grifter apart from the middle classes. we don't care if this gives you an existential tremor worse than 2008. You lost the election because you weren't disciplined. you might have not liked corbyn but you blew it. simple and own up to it. politics is not like shopping in Brent Cross you don't vote for who matches your ideals the best. This is your failure, not ours. remainers are far more responsible for hard brexit than leavers.
 
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thirdform

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get out of your echo chamber for fuck's sake. keir starmer isn't going to save the LP. your party has already decayed. one leader that is seen as an irritant by the majority of the membership and an absolute tosser by the electorate?
 
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thirdform

pass the sick bucket
version said:
To be fair, people were saying this about the Tories and GOP until Boris and Trump came along.
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Not me and not anyone with a sensible intellect. we always said in 2012 that UKIP were the main threat not because they would last, but because the tories would absorb them. which is exactly what they did. but people were happy to respect due parliamentary procedure because they thought Farage could be defeated through the free vote and robust analysis, which would of course be utter toss to anyone who has read the mass psychology of fascism...
 
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thirdform

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boris is the most democratic politician out of them lot. he literally managed to bring the electorate onto his side and extinguish ukip in one fell swoop. More evidence, if ever needed, that democracy is the jendarme of white supremacy and anti-migrant politics.
 
Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
thirdform said:
we don't care if this gives you an existential tremor worse than 2008.
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The irony is that I'm not particularly worried about myself. I don't work in manufacturing or agriculture. It's those sectors that are going to be fucked the hardest.

You'll no doubt call this crocodile tears or whatever because you've already decided I'm the spawn of satan or whatever. But leaving all emotion and personal beefs aside, that's the economic reality.
 
IdleRich

IdleRich

IdleRich
I'm surprised both that Eden's dad is a Tory and that Eden's dad has a PhD. I thought Eden was a noble prole from a long line of noble proles. The ones that go to the public library after work to read das kapital and join the trade union.
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Bit late I know, but this is literally exactly what I thought - even though Eden has actually told us this before my mind refused to accept it and just reset to what it SHOULD be.
 
C

comelately

Wild Horses
thirdform said:
But it's as if most anglo remainers just conveniently ignore that the brexiteers have got them where they want them to be.
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I think there's a confluence of several factors, but to the extent that's true - what was there really to be done? Join antifa?

It seems a bit thin.
 
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thirdform

pass the sick bucket
comelately said:
I think there's a confluence of several factors, but to the extent that's true - what was there really to be done? Join antifa?

It seems a bit thin.
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not acknowledge the legitimacy of the referendum, and show it up for what it really was, a clash within the tory party between amerophiles and hayekian superstate neolibs. the remain campaign did not do this.
 
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thirdform

pass the sick bucket
Mr. Tea said:
Also I dunno if it's worth pointing out that I've just spent twenty-odd pages arguing tooth and nail with someone whose view is the diametric opposite mine, but... anyway.
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you haven't argued anything. you aren't the spawn of satan either, that would be a compliment. you're just a bubbling druggy wreck. get it together, man. I agree with you! I agree with you the UK's economy is going to tank. but what is your solution? Fuck all.
 
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thirdform

pass the sick bucket
you're imputing a position to me which I don't subscribe to, which i have repeatedly said I don't subscribe to. I don't think brexit is a good thing. I'm a bloody browno for fuck's sake, don't be so condescending with your bonevolent Churchill-esque English high aristocratic authoritarianism. I can see the rise of hate crime in front of my face every day. I can see the nationalism, the xenophobia all increasing. the reversion to a melancholic European identity. what offends you is not that I'm a leaver, but that I hold your side to the exact same standards that you hold the leavers to.
 
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thirdform

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just admit it Tea. Deep down in your psyche you have more respect for Cameron than you do for exposing their sham. he's from well bred stock and a fine gentleman, after all.

It's not specific to you, it's a lot of the vocal remainers as well. ultimately, they went to vote like an obedient flock of sheep. and that was their crime. because they had sequestered themselves in a delusion that the EU was inherently progressive. clearly ignoring that the EU's border externalisation policies have turned places like Turkey and Libya into 21st century indentured servitude colonies and that the EU treats migrants seeking asylum like a plague which must be exterminated.

however, it's all fun and games when the end result was clubbing a fox to death with a bassball bat, isn't it?
 
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