Are happy people boring?

[baboon2004]

Half agree with that. Depression tends to be a (learned?) coping mechanism as well, just as much as being aggressively happy is. And it is typically confused with sadness, whereas frequently depression is not sadness but something else entirely, an inability or unwillingness (where does one stop and the other begin? dunno) to feel difficult feelings, feelings that will not be socially acceptable or are fantasied to result in disaster/shame/disgrace/abandonment etc. (the fantasy might be real or might not be).

I think a great many depressed people don't immediately present as such though, so that the accepted image of a 'depressive' is only sometimes accurate. People become incredibly good at hiding things.

 

[luka]

It's definitely not sadness. You're right. It's a shut down.

 

[baboon2004]

No conversation is ever worth having nothing is ever worth doing because they know in advance its not worth it nothing will come of it because nothing can ever happen. Reality is the state in which nothing can ever happen. Nothing is allowed to happen.

And there's a reason for this, because depression is (often, not always) precisely that state of holding one's own emotional world in limbo, in deep freeze. So nothing can ever happen, can ever change.

 

[luka]

I'm not say we should incinerate these people or withhold sympathy btw

 

[baboon2004]

It's definitely not sadness. You're right. It's a shut down.

Yep, and more than that, sadness is often precisely what is being defended against.

 

[baboon2004]

I'm not say we should incinerate these people or withhold sympathy btw

ah yeah, you deleted that post, it's fine

 

[luka]

I started a feeling thread for you to explain feelings btw did you notice?

 

[baboon2004]

I'll take a look at that later, need to upload a powerpoint

 

[DannyL]

Half agree with that. Depression tends to be a (learned?) coping mechanism as well, just as much as being aggressively happy is. And it is typically confused with sadness, whereas frequently depression is not sadness but something else entirely, an inability or unwillingness (where does one stop and the other begin? dunno) to feel difficult feelings, feelings that will not be socially acceptable or are fantasied to result in disaster/shame/disgrace/abandonment etc. (the fantasy might be real or might not be).

I think a great many depressed people don't immediately present as such though, so that the accepted image of a 'depressive' is only sometimes accurate. People become incredibly good at hiding things.

I'd second this. Working as a counsellor, you know you're onto something if people can confess their deep sadness and express emotion appropriately. Tears etc. - allowing themselves to be moved by their own situations. That's normally when you know you're on a home run. It is amazing the lenghts people will go to to avoid this. I've seen people start talking about literally anything to avoid this stuff - always interesting to say "let's stop in a minute... was anything happening for you there?"or similar.

 

[DannyL]

Depressed people turn their depression into an entire philosophy. It becomes this whole system. It's a politics. It's an aesthetics. It becomes a set of beliefs about the nature of the world, about reality, about the possible. And all of it is the most lethal poison.

I think the difference here (in what's being discussed) is between someone who recognises depression is a problem and is seeking help and someone in whom it's become a everyday stance, the way the world is, and tells you you're foolish to think otherwise. The English are particular shitty in this way, holding any optimism off at a critical distance in case the expression of emotion gets embarassing. God save me from the English. I should've been Brazilian I think.

 

[Corpsey]

One of my really good friends went through a period of undiagnosed depression (I don't think he ever did get diagnosed or had therapy but he seems better now) — and it was scary to see how totally negative he became about everything. Everything was boring, or futile, or just shit. And it WAS boring, too, to listen to him rant about it all. Obviously I was sympathetic and tried to counsel him from the perspective of my own depression — but at the same time I wanted to either get off the topic or get away from it. One of the really sad things about mental illness is how it pushes people away. There was a guy I lived with not long ago who turned out to have something seriously wrong with him, probably some form of schizophrenia. I was totally gutted for him because it all ended badly (he had to move out) but at the same time I was relieved not to have to deal with the paranoia and anxiety of it all. Obviously if he had been a really close friend or family member there'd have been no choice.

 

[DannyL]

and it was scary to see how totally negative he became about everything. Everything was boring, or futile, or just shit.

Was has been of great interest to me is to see how rapidly these feelings can go. Dissipate. Like they were never there. Pretty much without fail, I've found that the best of the bodywork disciplines can bounce these things out of existence. In minutes sometimes. It's bizarre when you experience it - walk in with a mood like a grey sky, lie down, breathe, the sun comes out.

With the caveats of course - this is my experience, I don't want to generalise from it. I did work at it, four and a half years of therapy (though I was getting this type of result early on) and I've never been clinically depressed. It's a kind of ambition of mine to test out this work on people with more severe depression and see if the experience is replicated.

 

[shiels]

Was has been of great interest to me is to see how rapidly these feelings can go. Dissipate. Like they were never there. Pretty much without fail, I've found that the best of the bodywork disciplines can bounce these things out of existence. In minutes sometimes. It's bizarre when you experience it - walk in with a mood like a grey sky, lie down, breathe, the sun comes out.

I get this thing where I think I’m depressed and my problems are unique and insurmountable, and I’m just this impossibly flawed and misunderstood character and everything is futile and…

Then I exercise, abuse substances less, sleep well, eat well, have sex and the next day… ah!

Obviously there are varying degrees here, lifestyle choices aren’t a fix for all. But if you’re someone who's always in your head you can fall into the trap of thinking you can think your way everywhere. At its worst
can just neglect your body

 

[entertainment]

It's amazing that sometimes all you need is that sense of moving somewhere forward. However insignificant the progress, the brighter outlook changes everything.

I'll go a month where I stop excercising, let bills pile up, procrastinate work, avoid seeing people, just drink, jack off and watch shit on TV, spiraling into a deeper hole.

Then I take one day where I clean my apartment, pay my bills and go for a run or something and the whole world has changed. All these possibilities suddenly presenting themselves.

Doing something everyday, just anything, that you can build on the next, is essential.

 

[droid]

Depression is a really serious form of mental illness. Suicide is the biggest killer of men under 45 in the UK. Im not sure if 'depressives are awful people' or 'a bit of exercise sorts it out' are such great takes TBH.

 

[luka]

I think it's ok to acknowledge the toll they take on us.

 

[shiels]

Depression is a really serious form of mental illness. Suicide is the biggest killer of men under 45 in the UK. Im not sure if 'depressives are awful people' or 'a bit of exercise sorts it out' are such great takes TBH.

Yes. I've worked in suicide prevention for 5 years and understand this well, a lot of work to make people aware of the stat you used there. This is a pretty reductive reading of my post though. As for Luka, i'm assuming he's maybe being a little provocative.

 

[entertainment]

Depression is a really serious form of mental illness. Suicide is the biggest killer of men under 45 in the UK. Im not sure if 'depressives are awful people' or 'a bit of exercise sorts it out' are such great takes TBH.

They aren't as absolutes, but cognitive behavioral therapy is one of the most effective treatments. Anything that can loosen your mind from the deadlock of hopelessness and introduce a little light, can go a long way towards altering your thought patterns about yourself and your situation.

 

[luka]

But yes obviously I wasn't expecting to be taken ~completely~ at face value.

 

[droid]

Yes. I've worked in suicide prevention for 5 years and understand this well, a lot of work to make people aware of the stat you used there. This is a pretty reductive reading of my post though. As for Luka, i'm assuming he's maybe being a little provocative.

Wasn't really aimed at you Shiels, fair play.