The cannabis debate

E

Electric Angel

Guest
tryptych said:
Care to offer any evidence in support of those claims? I'd say the medical debate is far from certain. Although I'll check myself...
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Why certainly I would be more than glad:
Cannabis use and psychosis
Cannabis use and mental health in young people
Cannabis use in adolescence and risk of adult psychosis
Cannabis and mental health

You can also use Google Scholar, just search medical or psychology journals and use the right keywords and you'll find a number of studies with similar findings.
 
Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
noel emits said:
Wait a minute. You started it!
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Heh, yeah, I did - mainly as a reaction to all the stupidly over-the-top anti-cannabis propaganda that's been put about in the press, even in papers that should know better, over the past couple of years.

A 'debate' along the lines of Weed Is Bad For You Just Say No No It's Not Shut Up It's Great was not what I had in mind.
 
N

noel emits

a wonderful wooden reason
I suppose I'd have to agree with Electric Angel in that I'd never advise anyone to smoke cannabis on a regular basis. But each to their own - we all have different requirements and tolerances. The trouble with prohibition as always is that it inhibits proper study and regulation, gives the substance the unnecessary allure of the forbidden that appeals to the young in particular and often leaves production and distribution in the hands of the less than scrupulous.
 
M

mms

sometimes
noel emits said:
I suppose I'd have to agree with Electric Angel in that I'd never advise anyone to smoke cannabis on a regular basis. But each to their own - we all have different requirements and tolerances. The trouble with prohibition as always is that it inhibits proper study and regulation, gives the substance the unnecessary allure of the forbidden that appeals to the young in particular and often leaves production and distribution in the hands of the less than scrupulous.
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i'd advise that with any drug tbh.
At a point in my life smoked loads every day and it didn't allow me to function well!

i don't think weed is particularly good for some people, same as some people go mental on white wine and not beer really, Britain has a very weird relationship to all mind altering substances.
 
B

bassnation

the abyss
Electric Angel said:
Personally I would never advise anyone to smoke cannabis on a regular basis. Whilst it may appear to be one of the 'safer' drugs, I would argue that it is not.

Whilst it is true that the facts are slightly distorted with regards to cannabis causing psychosis, such as schizophrenia, in that this tends to be the case only if the user already had a predisposition towards psychotic symptoms, cannabis can also lead to anxiety and depression - and as these can be both independent of biological factors, and thus predispositions, it could happen to anyone who smokes cannabis on a regular basis.

I highly, highly doubt that the government would ever legalise the production of cannabis or make the production of alcohol illegal.
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well, this is obviously anecdotal, but in my experience most people have used it without a problem. i know two people who've had issues (one with schizophrenia and the other with depression). but thats out of hundreds of people. thats pretty safe compared to almost any other recreational drug, illegal or legal.

i used to smoke it myself every day for 10 years or more. in recent years its just sort of stopped of its own accord, not exactly sure why, just finally got bored - nothing as exciting as a mental breakdown, i'm afraid. i occasionally like to have it, but if i don't - well, who cares.
 
E

Electric Angel

Guest
noel emits said:
I suppose I'd have to agree with Electric Angel in that I'd never advise anyone to smoke cannabis on a regular basis. But each to their own - we all have different requirements and tolerances. The trouble with prohibition as always is that it inhibits proper study and regulation, gives the substance the unnecessary allure of the forbidden that appeals to the young in particular and often leaves production and distribution in the hands of the less than scrupulous.
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I agree, but I am not sure whether having a legal production of cannabis would make youths think "Oh well, it's legal...no point smoking it now". I would say it is better that it be illegal, than legal.
 
Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
Electric Angel said:
I agree, but I am not sure whether having a legal production of cannabis would make youths think "Oh well, it's legal...no point smoking it now". I would say it is better that it be illegal, than legal.
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But the point is that the very illegality of the stuff is what drives producers to grow stronger and stronger gear. If it were legal it could be taxed progressively according to how strong it was, just like booze is.

Plenty of people (who like hash or normal weed, I mean) don't even like killer skunk, but increasingly that's all that's available.
 
owengriffiths

owengriffiths

Owen
Mr Tea:
But the point is that the very illegality of the stuff is what drives producers to grow stronger and stronger gear. If it were legal it could be taxed progressively according to how strong it was, just like booze is.

Plenty of people (who like hash or normal weed, I mean) don't even like killer skunk, but increasingly that's all that's available.
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The exact opposite is the case in Northern Ireland. Soapbar must make up 95% of blow sales here. Skunk presumably has never been availiable. Could it be that England is 'using up' all the supplies of grass? And as for illegality of a drug encouraging producers to make stronger stuff, why are E's increasingly made up of persil and the likes of cocaine mainly talcum powder
 
Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
But you don't go back to someone who's sold you Persil or talc, do you? And you can't really 'cut' weed (although that hasn't stopped some cunts trying to do just that, with tiny glass beads, can you believe).

Ultimately, both very strong weed and adulterated drugs are a result of prohibition, in that you have people trying to make as much money as possible (either by cornering the market by selling the strongest stuff, or by filling it out with crap) in a market regulated solely by supply and demand, rather than by legal requirements. Contrast this with legal drugs: when you buy a bottle of wine, you don't have to worry about whether it's going to contain no booze at all, twice as much booze as the last bottle you bought or some booze and a load of antifreeze.
 
owengriffiths

owengriffiths

Owen
It's an unregulated market. Do you always have the freedom of choice to 'shop elsewhere' for the likes of pills, i mean, the batch of stuff from the next man could be (and often is) just as shit. It's like you say with the wine. The problem is that in real life you have a clear option of buying Tesco Value range or maybe spending more on a Marks & Sparks product that will probably be better. The black market nature of drugs means that you cant guarantee what youre getting.
 
N

noel emits

a wonderful wooden reason
owengriffiths said:
The exact opposite is the case in Northern Ireland. Soapbar must make up 95% of blow sales here. Skunk presumably has never been availiable. Could it be that England is 'using up' all the supplies of grass? And as for illegality of a drug encouraging producers to make stronger stuff, why are E's increasingly made up of persil and the likes of cocaine mainly talcum powder
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Growers can charge more for strong bud. In the mainland UK at the moment apparently a good proportion of farmed weed is being produced by Vietnamese gangs. I imagine growing weed on a big scale in NI would historically have brought it's own problems if local organisations were not agreeable if you see what I mean. And of course lots of weed has been turning up adulterated due to 'bulking up' of various kinds.
 
owengriffiths

owengriffiths

Owen
Do you mean that a lot of the stuff in sale in Britain is homegrown? interesting, I would have assumed that it all came from abroad, the traditional way. It must take some infrastructure to grow all that locally on a big scale.
 
N

noel emits

a wonderful wooden reason
Yeah it seems a good proportion of the weed available in the UK is 'home' grown. You don't need much to do it really. There was a program on Radio 4 a couple of weeks ago about Vietnamese gangs and how they leave kids in the houses to look after the crop. If they get raided they just say they are 14 and usually the Police have to let them go coz it's too hard to identify them anyway. So it's kind of low risk as well.
 
T

tryptych

waiting for a time
Electric Angel said:
Why certainly I would be more than glad:
Cannabis use and psychosis
Cannabis use and mental health in young people
Cannabis use in adolescence and risk of adult psychosis
Cannabis and mental health

You can also use Google Scholar, just search medical or psychology journals and use the right keywords and you'll find a number of studies with similar findings.
Click to expand...

Those could all equally be correlation, rather than cause, of course. I think from those data to say that "depression and anxiety... can happen to anyone who smokes cannabis on a regular basis" is an unsubstantiated jump.

Obviously some people have a tendency towards mental health problem issues, and should probably avoid.
 
Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
owengriffiths said:
It's an unregulated market. Do you always have the freedom of choice to 'shop elsewhere' for the likes of pills, i mean, the batch of stuff from the next man could be (and often is) just as shit. It's like you say with the wine. The problem is that in real life you have a clear option of buying Tesco Value range or maybe spending more on a Marks & Sparks product that will probably be better. The black market nature of drugs means that you cant guarantee what youre getting.
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Exactly - it's one of the strongest arguments in favour of legalisation!
 
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