padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
that being said, the ISIS branding is pretty cool looking.
insert standard "Nazis, great aesthetics, Hugo Boss, etc" comment

presumably ISIS has/had a significant branding, marketing, PR, etc element, especially at its mid-2010s peak
 

IdleRich

IdleRich
that's never been true

Che Guevara t-shirts and posters on dorm room walls

when I was working in Chiapas in the early 00s EZLN - and specifically Marcos - merch was everywhere, inescapable

Che and especially Marcos are a far cry from ISIS but the principle is the same

not thing is off limits to capitalism. the only limit is your ability to market it to a given consumer demographic.

that is the impersonal genius part of consumerism - the potential to turn literally anything into a marketable commodity.
Just re-brand as freedom fighters and off you go....
 

sus

Moderator
I feel bad for the goddess, she's really dropped off the Google search results since the Islamic State got big. That'll really tank her sales figures.
 

sus

Moderator
EoQzzJzXYAEvvRf
 

constant escape

winter withered, warm
Maybe Zizek could be considered a forerunner to the alt-left, at least the alt-left I have in mind - still largely undefined, largely in reaction to neoliberalism.
 

constant escape

winter withered, warm
Yeah I've heard it applied to red scare. Think I brought it up a couple months ago, in some conversation about new developments/splinterings in the left.
 

constant escape

winter withered, warm
I think of dirtbag left as an alt-left in its infantile (or perhaps adolescent) stages. Seemingly largely informed by urges to seem cool, to tell off the institutional left, perhaps even aggravate the institutional left by flirting with right wing ideas.
 

constant escape

winter withered, warm
It (the dirtbag left) would be an early stage in the formation of a progressive heterodox left that is situated, by virtue of its heterogeneity, outside of the institutional (and therefore orthodox) left.
 

Corpsey.

Well-known member
I think of dirtbag left as an alt-left in its infantile (or perhaps adolescent) stages. Seemingly largely informed by urges to seem cool, to tell off the institutional left, perhaps even aggravate the institutional left by flirting with right wing ideas.
so is it in your eyes an emerging faction or something thats always been there on the margins? Im finishing up culture of narcissism, 1979, and that would describe whats written in there.
 

constant escape

winter withered, warm
Not sure really. I'd imagine there have almost always been fringe groups of this or that ideological variation, but dirtbag left does seem to be somewhat recent. Or perhaps the flocking of some leftist academics to such a place, that could be new. Justin Murphy comes to mind, think he was the one I first heard use the term. He also used heterodox left to describe himself, which is a term I often use as well.

I think there is just an awkward transition involved in realizing that capitalism can be liberal, not to be too reductive.

One way an alt-left can serve the greater political landscape is by functioning as a liaison between the institutional left and the alt-right.
 

constant escape

winter withered, warm
By awkward, and again to perhaps be too reductive, I mean you either:

recognize that capitalism is compatible with certain progressive values, and thus support capitalism to a degree...

or

recognize that capitalism is compatible with certain progressive values, and thus develop a skepticism of those values.
 

sus

Moderator
Great reminder to listen to that 'cast. I saw mention of it and made a note to and then forgot. I am bigtime lookin forward.
 

Corpsey.

Well-known member
I think whats called the dirtbag left does alot of what your describing but your probably right to say that theres no bridge made between that and the 'alt right' despite some overlap in ideas.

Is Joe Rogan saying it's either bernie or trump the greatest cultural accomplishment of the alt left to date?
 
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