Wuhan Killer Sneeze (thanks Tea)

[droid]

But, for the third time, the drop-off in the death rate that I'm talking about is recent - much more recent than last autumn, so a cessation of hospital testing at that time can't explain it. In fact it's happened since the summer just gone. The forum won't let me post the screenshot for some reason, but you can see for yourself.

United Kingdom COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

United Kingdom Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

They're giving a bit over 30,000 covid deaths in the UK since the start of June 2022. But 28,000 of them occurred in the 12 months up to the start of June this year. If that trend had continued, you'd expect nearly 12,000 covid deaths in the five months since then, whereas the true (or at least recorded) number is under 3,000.

So there has been a step change in the death rate, but it can't have been caused by any change in policy on testing or recording that happened a year ago, because it was much more recent than that.

There were 172,927 official covid deaths in the UK up to Dec 22. There are now 231,000 official covid deaths, so I was mistaken, its actually 60,000 since last December. In Ireland, Nearly 3500 people have died since the all mitigations were dropped in Feb 2022, thats a third of all total deaths.

The drop off in deaths you are referring to happened around June 23 and was replicated around much of Europe and seems to have been caused by the eye watering levels of infections and deaths at the end of 22/Spring 23, leaving the survivors with some level of immunity, but we can see deaths rising again from about mid-August, which fits into waning immunity at 3-6 months after infection and the spread of new variants. It wasn't a step change due to reduced virulence, the virus had simply killed everyone it could kill, until the next wave which started about 6 weeks ago.

You just have to look at the global numbers to see how fucked this is. The official WHO estimate of deaths is about 7 million, though they have informally acknowledged its probably closer to 14 million. The economist excess deaths tally puts it between 18-31 million. The generally accepted figure is about 27 million. Additionally, the number of people who have of have had long covid is now between 2-300 million. There is a massive and deliberate undercounting, and its working.

 

[droid]

did a shift today which entailed a respiratory depression tutorial in a nearby hospital, walked in on a team in complete meltdown because staff who come down with Covid symptoms but “feel ok to work should come to work”, except it’s a respiratory unit treating acute long term and palliative care patients

their death rate is massively up, management attempted to dismiss a band 8 matron of 40 years service when she started questioning the drop off in testing entirely, it’s knock on effects with patient mortality/patient health and staff health in general (highest number of individual Covid infections by frontline staff in this dept is 8 ffs, viral load heavy environs) and the absurdity of how cheap and easy testing is to complete with in-patient care

NHS is falling apart, huge budgets go to agency personnel recruited by pvt companies, privatisation by drip drip supply x off the chart demand - if a respiratory team can’t prevent preventable deaths what is oncology really like or general surgery or other key realms of services which were fucked prior to Covid

farce, we’re wide open, the new normal

Its fucked beyond belief. The nosocomial death rate from Covid is between 10-30% depending on the hospital. Like 100-300 times the normal death rate in society. Whatever one thinks about sacrificing the sick, infirm and the elderly at the altar of the economy, and indeed forcing the rest of society to risk chronic illness and disability, removing mitigations in hospitals in service to the myth that covid is harmless is utterly indefensible.

 

[Murphy]

Grim, mass resignations coming in, “ethics? duty of care? do no harm?”. Think an agency consultant did a 12 hour night shift recently and charged £12k. Have to google it

Not testing with care homes, social care where the same carer can visit up to 20 individuals a day, any health environment where end of life care could kick in rapid, I don’t get it, it’s beyond incompetent and seems designed to fracture services further into agency lares. Amount of experienced people who’ve left for Australia, NZ and the US in recent years, who offer generous resettlement packages and postgraduate/doctoral/postdoctoral/research grants and fees all paid for, is mental. As soon as our youngest is 16 we’re off too. Fuck this shithole country

Tangenting (have an nhs thread) just venting seeing people who also did alpha and delta wave care nonstop seeing relentless death getting fucked out of pensions, perverse amount of cortisol in certain units feeding on staff very much like a virus too and incompetent health board directors ripping into budgetary upgrades (concrete upgrade budget scandal up next)

Britain is beyond help. Look how much city councils spend on ‘outside support’ services eg Sheffield, look how many Cobra meetings Johnson missed, Truss/Kwarteng scam consequences for mortgage markets, relentless ass rape

 

[mixed_biscuits]

did a shift today which entailed a respiratory depression tutorial in a nearby hospital, walked in on a team in complete meltdown because staff who come down with Covid symptoms but “feel ok to work should come to work”, except it’s a respiratory unit treating acute long term and palliative care patients

their death rate is massively up, management attempted to dismiss a band 8 matron of 40 years service when she started questioning the drop off in testing entirely, it’s knock on effects with patient mortality/patient health and staff health in general (highest number of individual Covid infections by frontline staff in this dept is 8 ffs, viral load heavy environs) and the absurdity of how cheap and easy testing is to complete with in-patient care

NHS is falling apart, huge budgets go to agency personnel recruited by pvt companies, privatisation by drip drip supply x off the chart demand - if a respiratory team can’t prevent preventable deaths what is oncology really like or general surgery or other key realms of services which were fucked prior to Covid

farce, we’re wide open, the new normal

Staff should do nose and throat irrigation as per the many papers to bring down transmissible virus in their airways. Everyone wins.

 

[Murphy]

Yes I’m not Tea where you 2 flounce around indefinitely pinning the tail on various dead donkeys

 

[mixed_biscuits]

@WashYourHands Yes, I know, I'm depriving you of the pleasure of whinging about the situation by giving you a simple and effective solution with a firm evidence base. But at least now you won't need to move abroad.

 

[Murphy]

Whinging is 300+ pages ole-ing with a man who thinks he can appeal to your thoughts

It’s ok, you could randomly acquire crush injuries one monstrous day and be nursed in airless room by staff not permitted to test, further compromising your recovery

Fare thee well, little donkey

 

[mixed_biscuits]

Whinging is 300+ pages ole-ing with a man who thinks he can appeal to your thoughts

It’s ok, you could randomly acquire crush injuries one monstrous day and be nursed in airless room by staff not permitted to test, further compromising your recovery

Fare thee well, little donkey

Those staff can do the irrigation at home off their own backs. Doesn't need to be official.

 

[Mr. Tea]

You just have to look at the global numbers to see how fucked this is. The official WHO estimate of deaths is about 7 million, though they have informally acknowledged its probably closer to 14 million. The economist excess deaths tally puts it between 18-31 million. The generally accepted figure is about 27 million. Additionally, the number of people who have of have had long covid is now between 2-300 million. There is a massive and deliberate undercounting, and its working.

I'm well aware of the estimates - most reliable sources I've seen have a wide uncertainty range but have tended to centre around the 20 million mark.

Undercounting has probably been partially deliberate, as in highly authoritarian states like China and Russia, and partially inadvertent, in countries like India, where for the most part the health infrastructure needed to perform mass testing and record and report the results doesn't exist.

I doubt there's any happening here. Makes no sense for the government to deliberately suppress daily death rates in single or low double figures while numbers well north of a thousand were being accurately reported during the two big peaks in 2020 and early '21.

 

[Murphy]

Those staff can do the irrigation at home off their own backs. Doesn't need to be official.

you need planning permission from the council and water board to irrigate a property fully, doofus

 

[droid]

I'm well aware of the estimates - most reliable sources I've seen have a wide uncertainty range but have tended to centre around the 20 million mark.

Undercounting has probably been partially deliberate, as in highly authoritarian states like China and Russia, and partially inadvertent, in countries like India, where for the most part the health infrastructure needed to perform mass testing and record and report the results doesn't exist.

I doubt there's any happening here. Makes no sense for the government to deliberately suppress daily death rates in single or low double figures while numbers well north of a thousand were being accurately reported during the two big peaks in 2020 and early '21.

A lot of things don't make sense.

It makes no sense to stop testing people on admission to hospital and to remove all mitigations in healthcare settings when covid rates are consistently high because patients are acutely vulnerable and die at 100-300 times the rate of people in general society.

It makes no sense to tell NHS workers not to test and then force them back to work even if they are positive for covid and work with vulnerable people, especially when 20% of doctors and nurses who develop long covid can never work again.

It makes no sense to allow the unmitigated spread of a virus that continues to kill and cause severe illness and can cause damage to nearly every organ in the body and seems to be causing widespread society level immune dysregulation when simple solutions exist to prevent and minimise the damage.

It makes no sense to completely ignore the long term damage covid is causing when school absenteeism and the numbers of people out of work due to disability are both at all time highs, major financial institutions are ringing alarm bells about the economic problems caused by the continued spread of covid and studies are calling out the 'unfathomable burden' long covid will have on health services.

It makes no sense to adopt a vaccines only policy for covid and then restrict vaccines for virtually everybody except the acutely vulnerable and even then to discourage the use of vaccines with the constant insidious suggestions that covid is no worse than a cold despite the near unanimity of scientific opinion that this is false.

The difference between 20/21 and now are clear. Back then we pretended to care. Now we dont give a fuck, and deaths and all the other associated accumulating harms are an inconvenience to that mindset.

 

[sufi]

it all makes sense
according to dom

https://covid19.public-inquiry.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/10/31180752/INQ000273872.pdf

 

[Mr. Tea]

@droid I'm the last person you'll catch defending the government's performance on the whole course of the pandemic, from the disgracefully late first lockdown onwards, but I don't get who this is aimed at:

It makes no sense to adopt a vaccines only policy for covid and then restrict vaccines for virtually everybody except the acutely vulnerable and even then to discourage the use of vaccines with the constant insidious suggestions that covid is no worse than a cold despite the near unanimity of scientific opinion that this is false.

Vaccines were made available as soon as they were ready, and were not "restricted" - I got two shots in 2021 and a booster last year. They were not hard to get hold of and I didn't have to wait that long. There were individual right-wing voices within the nuttier end of the Tory party* and miscellaneous non-denominational reactionaries downplaying the risks of covid, but this was not the official government line at all, which was "Stay at home, save lives."

*like this absolute bellend who compared the roll-out of covid-19 vaccines to the Holocaust and was - rightly - immediately suspended from the party: https://www.bmj.com/content/380/bmj.p81

 

[droid]

it all makes sense
according to dom

https://covid19.public-inquiry.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/10/31180752/INQ000273872.pdf

Yeah, Ive been following that. Whats most remarkable is that we are now all embracing the policies of a bunch of "fuck pigs, cunts and morons".

 

[droid]

@droid I'm the last person you'll catch defending the government's performance on the whole course of the pandemic, from the disgracefully late first lockdown onwards, but I don't get who this is aimed at:



Vaccines were made available as soon as they were ready, and were not "restricted" - I got two shots in 2021 and a booster last year. They were not hard to get hold of and I didn't have to wait that long. There were individual right-wing voices within the nuttier end of the Tory party* and miscellaneous non-denominational reactionaries downplaying the risks of covid, but this was not the official government line at all, which was "Stay at home, save lives."

*like this absolute bellend who compared the roll-out of covid-19 vaccines to the Holocaust and was - rightly - immediately suspended from the party: https://www.bmj.com/content/380/bmj.p81

They are restricted NOW. Vaccines wane after 3-6 months. When was your last booster? I havent been eligible for a vaccine in 18 months.

Here are the current eligibility criteria in the UK, which excludes the majority of the UK's population.

aged 65 years old or over (you need to be 65 years old by 31 March 2024)
aged 6 months to 64 years old and are at increased risk
living in a care home for older adults
a frontline health or social care worker
aged 16 to 64 years old and are a carer
aged 12 to 64 years old and live with someone with a weakened immune system

So, on the one hand we are told that covid isnt so deadly anymore because of vaccines, and on the other hand that we dont need vaccines because covid isnt so deadly anymore.

Which is up there with the idea that covid is a dangerous disease so the best thing to do is to catch covid so you have immunity to covid.

None of it makes any sense. It falls apart at even the slightest examination. The only reason it flies at all is because people want to believe it.

 

[Mr. Tea]

Covid is also less deadly than it was a few years ago because the more virulent strains, particularly delta, are less prevalent than they were, having been supplanted by other strains such as omicron that are more infectious but cause a less serious syndrome.

 

[droid]

Omicron has been found to be as intrinsically virulent as the original wild covid strain and barely less virulent than Alpha/Delta. Less people died because of the vaccines and immunity due to prior infection.

Conclusions Omicron has comparable intrinsic severity to the ancestral Wuhan strain although the effective severity is substantially lower in Omicron cases due to vaccination. With a moderate-to-high coverage of vaccination, hospitalized COVID-19 patients caused by Omicron subvariants appeared to have similar age-specific risks of fatality to patients hospitalized with influenza A(H1N1)pdm09.

Omicron as severe as other COVID variants -large U.S. study

The Omicron variant of the SARS-CoV2 virus is intrinsically as severe as previous variants, , according to a preprint version of a large U.S.studythat counters assumptions in other studies that it was more transmissible but less severe.

www.reuters.com

Clinical severity of SARS-CoV-2 Omicron BA.4 and BA.5 lineages compared to BA.1 and Delta in South Africa - Nature Communications

South Africa experienced a resurgence in COVID-19 in 2022 driven by Omicron subvariants BA.4 and BA.5. Here, the authors investigate the severity of infections caused by these subvariants, and find no difference in the risk of severe outcomes when compared to Omicron BA.1, whilst all Omicron...

www.nature.com

Intrinsic and effective severity of COVID-19 cases infected with the ancestral strain and Omicron BA.2 variant in Hong Kong

Background Understanding severity of infections with SARS-CoV-2 and its variants is crucial to inform public health measures. Here we used COVID-19 patient data from Hong Kong to characterise the severity profile of COVID-19 and to examine factors associated with fatality of infection. Methods...

www.medrxiv.org

 

[droid]

So essentially, our immunity is based on constant reinfection, an average of 1.3 a year. And with every wave of infection more people suffer with persistent symptoms, long-covid, delayed severe acute sequelae like strokes, cardiac events, neurological issues and diabetes, and severe cases of normally benign illness due to immune dysregulation.

This doesnt bode well for the future. You have what? 20 years or so to retirement? You should cash in your pension right now because you are not going to survive another 26 covid infections.

 

[Mr. Tea]

Given that all restrictions on movement and social gatherings were lifted in 2021, then if omicron were no less deadly than delta and the benefit of vaccines/boosters were to start to fade almost immediately, then you'd expect the death rate to have been steadily rising since, what, the middle of last year? Whereas it fell to single figures over the summer just gone, before a very small, temporary uptick in September:



In fact, if every claim you've made here were true, we should be right back to square one with hundreds of deaths a day, shouldn't we?

 

[Mr. Tea]

Here's the Worldometers chart for the global daily death rate:



If a deliberate suppression of covid death rates is going on, then it's being perpetrated by every government in the world in perfect concert with each other, including all those governments that permitted their health and statistics agencies to report such deaths accurately in 2020-22.