How full of rage are you?

[thirdform]

this is exactly the halfway house @other_life was being reproached for.

either the human will is divinely established, in which case it is not subject to material constraints, or the material world is determining. there's no middle ground. compatibilism is nonsense.

 

[other_life]

ack! i've been slain

 

[thirdform]

Not necessarily, you don't need a religious affiliation to believe with your whole heart that there is an order that stands outside of time that guides the progress of the cosmos as time progresses. I think Bohm called it the pilot wave, or Rta/satya in the Vedic texts, Logos in classical thinking, or Gnon. And of course your can have free will within such a determined framework because the influence of human will is necessarily limited compared to the overarching principes, and either concordant or discordant with it.

Ghazali reproached the philosophers for claiming that God was unaware of particulars, which is what you're doing here.

Don't! it's a bad habit!

 

[HMGovt’s Glorious Return!]

so if . because the debate is to do with whether God acts in time or outside of time.

I know, because that is what I said above

 

[thirdform]

I know, because that is what I said above

and yet for your scheme to work, god has to be unaware or his mediation of particulars is nonexistent.

This is flawed for the principle reason that it means that God is not truly omnipotent, and hence it is ontologically conceivable to think of a being greater than the God you've conceived of here.

 

[HMGovt’s Glorious Return!]

Ghazali reproached the philosophers for claiming that God was unaware of particulars, which is what you're doing here.

Don't! it's a bad habit!

Did not say that. You're prone to reading your interpretation into others. God is the particulars, is what I'm saying. But humans are exceptional particulars with a degree of freedom in their realm, but not necessarily at the level god operates on. Try exerting free will when you're dead in a universe that carries on without you. Lol.

 

[thirdform]

Did not say that. You're prone to reading your interpretation into others. God is the particulars, is what I'm saying. But humans are exceptional particulars with a degree of freedom in their realm, but not necessarily at the level god operates on. Try exerting free will when you're dead in a universe that carries on without you. Lol.

no, God is the universal, not the particulars.

 

[HMGovt’s Glorious Return!]

God is immortality and will, human is mortality and will. Gives life it's piquancy, doesn't it?

 

[thirdform]

Try exerting free will when you're dead in a universe that carries on without you. Lol.

I'm a hard determinist, so I don't accept this hypothetical. you need to direct it to biscuits who actually believes in free will.

 

[HMGovt’s Glorious Return!]

no, God is the universal, not the particulars.

Why not both? Is there any distinction? The water and the wave.

 

[HMGovt’s Glorious Return!]

I'm a hard determinist, so I don't accept this assumption. you need to direct it to biscuits who actually believes in free will.

Not a tenable position. Maybe put down the Marx and check out some science some time.

 

[thirdform]

All I'm doing is illustrating the stakes of your argument. Personally I'm of a complete opposite persuasion. no free will whatsoever, because freedom can only be freedom from, not freedom to.

 

[thirdform]

Not a tenable position. Maybe put down the Marx and check out some science some time.

it's entirely tenable, even by your own admission.

 

[HMGovt’s Glorious Return!]

Sounds like a slogan and an excuse. Inhuman, defeatist, defeated, grist. I ain't going out like that.

 

[HMGovt’s Glorious Return!]

Hard determinism no, soft determinism as a resilient realisation of teleology, perhaps.

 

[thirdform]

Sounds like a slogan and an excuse. Inhuman, defeatist, defeated, grist. I ain't going out like that.

And yet you reject occasionalism, so you're the one defeated here.

 

[HMGovt’s Glorious Return!]

I don't know what that is. Sounds gay.

 

[thirdform]

I don't know what that is. Sounds gay.

thought you went to Oxford? Conservatives these days!

 

[HMGovt’s Glorious Return!]

I looked it up. T.e. Lawrence went to my college and we all decided going in that direction was a failed experiment. You're welcome to it, and cousin marriage 👍

 

[thirdform]

I looked it up. T.e. Lawrence went to my college and we all decided going in that direction was a failed experiment. You're welcome to it, and cousin marriage 👍

What, pray tell, gave you the absurd idea I want to get married, let alone marry one of my moronic cousins?